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VARoadstter
VARoadstter
Join Date 02/2007
0

Information Blackout (scout killer)

July 23, 2008 2:04:14 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
Fairly new to the game. Have spent hours reading through the strategy section and it is both helpful and overwhelming at the same time. That's ok, I suspect as I gain game experience it will improve. I have been particularly impressed with the level of detail and supporting data provided by RagingAmish among others in explaining the guiding principles behind gameplay (in addition to lots of hard data).

Having a large, mobile scout force is mentioned as a critical factor in playing at a high level and I can certainly understand why this is so highly touted. When I read about it I spent some time considering how one should counter that particular strategy as it would do a lot to confuse and/or hold off an opponent who is used to having complete enemy intel as part of their overall method for play. Most obvious would be some kind of strategic counter which is able to quickly intercept incoming scouts with the intent to destroy them and deprive my opponent of their ability. I have not seen anyone mention such an idea and was wondering:

1) if it can be done
2) if it would be worthwhile
3) if there were another way to deal with it
strategy
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VARoadstter
Kitkun
Join Date 06/2008
+175
Reply #1 July 23, 2008 2:35:46 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
I use a few hangars at me planets closer to the front.
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spiralblitz
Join Date 03/2008
+10
Reply #2 July 23, 2008 2:51:42 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
Yeah but with hangars the scout is already on the planet and knows whats there so its kinda pointless. Right now there is no real way to keep a scout from reaching one of your planets and knowing whats on it.
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Howdidudothat
Join Date 04/2008
+34
Reply #3 July 23, 2008 3:54:09 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
It is extremely difficult to stop a scout from reaching your inner planets. However, fighters will take them out quickly; Kitkun mentions hangers. If you are truly concerned with killing those little buggers, building a jump phase inhibitor also works, as it takes tech tier 6 for scouts to neutralize the inhibitor effects to scouts.

I also find inhibitors useful if you know that your opponent likes kamakazi runs on your empire.
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Shadow_of_Light
Join Date 12/2007
+8
Reply #4 July 23, 2008 4:31:53 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
as of now there is no effective way to stop scouts from reaching your inner empire, other then PJI's , wuch can easily be counterd ..... and cost + research + slots + money... and even more slots since the PJI's has limited range, so building it on 1 side of the planet and the other side wont be affected.... thus you need 2 PJI's 2
have a smal chance to stop incoming scouts/fleets


just look at it from the other side
i hate it when im scouting and someone kills a scout, it slows my intelligence and building a new 1, brining it to its right spot etc takes a lil time.. wich i mostly dont have

if a planet = not scanned for over 360 seconds then the data = pretty old, meaning alot of new stuff can be here already, defenses. ships etc.etc.
thus the best defense i know to counter enemy scouts is to build a hangar bay, scouts 'll take damaage if they enter orbit, so they need to keep spawning scouts, eventualy he'll have a handfull of scouts waiting at the border, becuase replacing them = just to time wasting / expensive
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rasta773
Join Date 03/2008
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Reply #5 July 23, 2008 8:57:40 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
as mentioned before fighters are the best way as they are the only ones who can outspeed scouts. but just 1 or 2 sqaudrens is usually not enough. phase jump inhibiters are usually too expensive in resources and slots.
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Dacus
Join Date 07/2008
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Reply #6 July 24, 2008 10:20:23 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
1 hangar over all your bases, 2 on the front line bases (all with FTs only) and a PJT is the counter for the scouts (2 for big planets, as they are quite limited in range)
however, don't count it too much on it ... it's just a small counter and can be overcome easily

the additional bonus for this "fighting scouts" strategy is that an invading fleet will have something to do until your cavalry arrives there (PJT won't let them move away easily and hangars are quite sturdy, so it takes some time to destroy them), so it's not pointless
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israil
Join Date 07/2008
+2
Reply #7 July 24, 2008 12:42:04 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
on the same note, I was playing a single player game and noticed one of my AI enemies doing something pretty crafty. My hangars were consistantly killing his scouts, so after probably the 3rd scout that was killed, he started sending flak frigates to scout my planets. It may have been a more expensive option, but his "scouting" flaks survived and he weakened several of my planets defenses by destroying their fighter squadrons. It was some nice adaptability that I wasnt expecting from the AI, kudos to the programmers.
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General_Harada
Join Date 02/2008
+1
Reply #8 July 24, 2008 1:57:10 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
I play mostly against AI or LAN opponents, since my internet connection blows...

Hangars do the job nicely. Scouts rarely get past my edge planets, but then I am a fanatic about building hangar defenses. First it discourages the AI. Second, once you kill the seige craft, pirates are a minor annoyance. Third, they don't have a range. Fourth, they make a nice 'non-fleet cap' addition to my fleet if I ever have to fall back. Add in a repair platform and, unless you get blind-sided by an enemy armada, you'll always have time to muster a fleet defense. 12-14 bombers take out an HC every other pass.

Beam/Cannon defenses never seem to cut it for myself.


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rasta773
Join Date 03/2008
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Reply #9 July 24, 2008 10:37:27 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
on the same note, I was playing a single player game and noticed one of my AI enemies doing something pretty crafty. My hangars were consistantly killing his scouts, so after probably the 3rd scout that was killed, he started sending flak frigates to scout my planets. It may have been a more expensive option, but his "scouting" flaks survived and he weakened several of my planets defenses by destroying their fighter squadrons. It was some nice adaptability that I wasnt expecting from the AI, kudos to the programmers.


the one problem with using anything other than a scout for scouting is that you have to do it all manually as other units dont have the scout ability. also, other ships are quite a bit slower so it will take a lot longer for you to cover the same amount of planets your normal scouts would.

I play mostly against AI or LAN opponents, since my internet connection blows...Hangars do the job nicely. Scouts rarely get past my edge planets, but then I am a fanatic about building hangar defenses. First it discourages the AI. Second, once you kill the seige craft, pirates are a minor annoyance. Third, they don't have a range. Fourth, they make a nice 'non-fleet cap' addition to my fleet if I ever have to fall back. Add in a repair platform and, unless you get blind-sided by an enemy armada, you'll always have time to muster a fleet defense. 12-14 bombers take out an HC every other pass.Beam/Cannon defenses never seem to cut it for myself.


i do love hangers as well, but i usually only stick with 1-2 per planet to discourage scouts, unless i have a ton of money to burn (unfortunately this is not a problem i often face). i do find turrets useful at times, since you can have 4 of them for every hanger (6 in advent's case) just giving up 1 hanger can give you 4 turrets, or 2 turrets and a repair generator that you can use to cover the hanger's themselves, you'd be suprised at how much more hesitent people are about taking out hangers when they have a nice battery of 4 turrets surrounding them. wont do a thing against larger fleets but aginst small raids it can be really nice.

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PaulTa
Join Date 05/2008
+2
Reply #10 July 26, 2008 4:01:57 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums
You normally don't even have to deny your opponent that kind of intelligence. Typically, the people I see online tend not to even scout properly or often enough. Sheesh, I consider myself an expert player, but I could still scout better.


This game really doesn't offer a lot of "counterintelligence" abilities. I think it would be kinda cool if someone couldn't just jump into the system with a scout and then get a full numbers reading on how many ships there are in that whole gravity well, that maybe the player would have to approximate or count or something, but alas, the game is not THAT in depth. Probably for the better too.
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