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Bullface
Bullface
Join Date 07/2007
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A possible solution to fleets bypassing a Starbase (Other than giving them all movement)

December 17, 2008 9:31:22 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

I definitely agree with those that think that the SB needs a range increase.

In addition to a range increase I have possible solution to fleets just going around the SB and on to the next system. A SB could greatly slow ships speed that are trying to bypass it. There are a couple ways you could implement this idea (keep in mind I am completely ignorant of the coding required in any of these solutions.)

1. As large as they are it is reasonable to think that they would create a significant amount of their own gravity. If I'm not mistaken I think that I saw somewhere that ships travel faster to the center of a grav well and slower when exiting it. (I’ve never really noticed it) A SB could act the same way having it's own mini grav well within the grav well causing any ship traveling away from it to travel much slower. If it would be easier you could make this an ability I would think for realism sake you would want it to affect both enemy and friendly ships.

2. The second and maybe better idea would be to make a "tractor beam" type ability that would slow or stop only enemy ships or even pull them in toward the SB for a period of time preventing them from getting past it easily.

Ideally you would want whatever effect you use would need be the same or larger than the attack range.

Like I said I'm not sure the details or balance issues involved, but since there are already slow ship speed abilities in the game, I would think that that adding this as an ability wouldn't be to hard.

 

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Bullface
Annatar11
Join Date 11/2006
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Reply #1 December 17, 2008 9:43:57 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Why not just attach a phase inhibitor effect in one of the upgrades? Perhaps one of the weapon or hp upgrade lines.

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Bullface
psyck0
Join Date 06/2007
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Reply #2 December 17, 2008 9:46:50 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Because the phase inhibitor prevents them leaving, but they could already be past the starbase's range.

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Bullface
Crowsbane
Join Date 11/2008
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Reply #3 December 17, 2008 9:49:06 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

You could also place mines just outside the starbase range to "funnel" incomming fleets into the effective kill zone. Maybe even as an automatic deployment or upgrade to the base. That could ballance out the range issue

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Bullface
DeadlyShoe
Join Date 03/2006
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Reply #4 December 17, 2008 9:51:18 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Use mines to block fleet movement past the frontier. 

Starbases have ways of forcing people to come to them, like Auxilary Government, clusters of hangars and factories, etc.

There's always the Vasari method too, just move around to squat on whatever phase route the enemy is using

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Bullface
Annatar11
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Reply #5 December 17, 2008 10:07:40 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting psyck0,
reply 2
Because the phase inhibitor prevents them leaving, but they could already be past the starbase's range.

Range is easily changed and is really not a limiter

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Bullface
Bullface
Join Date 07/2007
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Reply #6 December 17, 2008 10:19:39 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Annatar11,
reply 5

Quoting psyck0, reply 2Because the phase inhibitor prevents them leaving, but they could already be past the starbase's range.

Range is easily changed and is really not a limiter

 

I think the the problem would be if you where actually fighting and needed to retreat instead of just trying to get past it. It's not to difficult to destroy a phase inhibitor and retreat, or destroy it early in case you have to retreat. If it's in a SB you essentially lose that option. If you have to retreat you probably don't have the power to take out the SB first.

 

 

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Bullface
Annatar11
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Reply #7 December 17, 2008 10:29:25 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

I think the the problem would be if you where actually fighting and needed to retreat instead of just trying to get past it. It's not to difficult to destroy a phase inhibitor and retreat, or destroy it early in case you have to retreat. If it's in a SB you essentially lose that option. If you have to retreat you probably don't have the power to take out the SB first.

The old Sins beta PJIs were kinda cool that way - they only blocked the fleet from jumping deeper into your territory. They could jump back to a neutral or hostile with no penalty. Something like that would work pretty well as part of a high-tier starbase upgrade, methinks.

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Phalnax811
Join Date 07/2007
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Reply #8 December 17, 2008 10:33:07 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Yeah, they def should have a range increase and someway to stop enemey movements...maybe just a passive ability that doesn't allowe phase jumps out of the system.

They also, ALL need to start with a fighter garrison.  A massive starbase like that would already have fighters.  Well it should have command points you could purchase fighters with.  I know Avent start with them but the others should too.

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Bullface
DeadlyShoe
Join Date 03/2006
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Reply #9 December 17, 2008 10:47:06 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

fighters on the TEC starbase only costs twice as much as a hangar defense. That's pretty good all things considered. The trade upgrade costs 4 times as much as equivalent trade posts... and the construction upgrade is like eight times as much as an equivalent frigate fac. Brutal.

Just use carriers.

for reference the missile range on a tec starbase is 10,500, laser range is 7500 and beam range is 5000

missile range on a LRM frigate is 9800

the range of all weapons on a Kol battleship is 5000

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Dargoon999
Join Date 05/2008
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Reply #10 December 17, 2008 10:49:08 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

I have not played Entrenchment, but I thought I could bring in my 2 cents. How about granting Starbases a weapon jammer affecting ALL ships inside a gravity well. Only a medium radius around the starbase would not be affected by the weapon jammer. Meaning that all enemy ship would have NO CHOICE but to destroy the starbase before trying to outflank enemy defensive positions.

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Bullface
Annatar11
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Reply #11 December 17, 2008 10:50:26 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Dargoon999,
reply 10
I have not played Entrenchment, but I thought I could bring in my 2 cents. How about granting Starbases a weapon jammer affecting ALL ships inside a gravity well. Only a medium radius around the starbase would not be affected by the weapon jammer. Meaning that all enemy ship would have NO CHOICE but to destroy the starbase before trying to outflank enemy defensive positions.

The Advent base has an ability upgrade that screws with ship weapons/targeting. I haven't gotten to try out how effective it is, though.

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DarkSide73
Join Date 04/2006
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Reply #12 December 17, 2008 11:25:36 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

use the phase inhibitor to block them in, place mines at the incoming phase lines about 4000 bucs worth.

 

Place fully upgraded turrents behind the min field and intersperce hangers with flak cannons between the cannons.  Place a shield on your planet if your human and build at least 2 repair bays.  Then in between all that crap - clustered just close enough to your planet and equa-distant to the defense line place your star base.

 

On the back side of the planet place mines to cover any holes.

Station your strike craft on the for side of the planet.

 

When the enemy jumps in  - they should jump into the mine field - that should start the heavy loses.

Then because your gate node and planet shield are next to your star base - there is no way to get out the planet without fighting.  Also if they try to go to the back of the planet to bomb the will run into mines and fighters.

 

Teh starbase should be well defended since it has it's weapons along with your turrents to support it.

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Simmyaz
Join Date 08/2008
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Reply #13 December 17, 2008 11:53:53 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

I wish that all 3 starbases didn't move and were able to cover at least 30-40 percent of the circumference of a grav well.  Also resupply level 2 on the tec station radius is very very small compared to level 1.

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Annatar11
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Reply #14 December 17, 2008 12:07:37 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Also resupply level 2 on the tec station radius is very very small compared to level 1.

I think someone pointed that out as a bug, the range seems to drop pretty sharply.. I haven't played TEC yet myself.

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