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[MOD WIP] Star Trek: Sacrifice of Angels 2 - 0.7.7R Update 6/24/2016

Looking for Modelers and Texture Artists

By on December 14, 2009 11:11:20 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums External Link

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June 2, 2013 12:37:46 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

I only wanted to make it more realistic.I am not getting bored, when ships travel around especially when it looks great.

 

The mechanic of this game makes npc s deal with pirates much. CPU spents money for bounty and if you make them useless then CPU s investigation is for nothing and as player I would never spent money at this mod for pirates. This gives a bonus for players. Against CPU it is easier to play anyway and cause of this changes in balance I didn' t like it.

It is the same when you play with other players. Never spent money for bounty cause pirates are useless.

But it is your decision. Then I will keep this changes for myself. Thx for this nice mod anyway.

 

 

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June 2, 2013 4:54:31 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

There appears to be quite a few planets with an ability called TBA that scrolls off the screen so you can't read what its doing; what is going on there?

 

Sadism.  I'll explain X class planets at some point, but for now you'll have to figure it out yourself.

 

- I liked scaling down ships. This is really good idea. But movements should be also reduced. That is why I changed the movement of starships. For me it looks more realistic.

 

They were, they're 50% faster(scale wise) and 25% slower than they used to be.  Initially, halfscale was done at halfscale, across the board.  The complaints of lengthy transit were legitimate, and so were bumper cars fleet battles.  So, weapon ranges and transit speed were bumped back up a bit.

 

Ship roles.

 

The Miranda is, originally, inferior to the Consitution, a heavy cruiser.  The setting is not TWOK however, it's post DS9.  During DS9, the Miranda, a later, mass produced ship, is still in heavy use as a supply ship and escort frigate.  It's recieved numerous upgrades and overhauls over the years.  An old ship, but a frequently improved ship.  The Constitution has been mothballed for a century.  It's weapons and power systems are antiquity, combat would be ineffective.  There are shuttles with more firepower than that thing actually had.  It's stats in game are significantly improved over what they should be.

 

What "role" a ship has is largely irrelevant.  The Excelsior is in the long range frigate slot, it is not a long range frigate.  It's not behaving as one either.  It's an early era ship, so it's on the frigate page.  There is some function that remains, such as anti-fighter ships being good for taking down fighters, but the role type is not definitive of the ship.  Their location is relative to their modernity.

 

As for pirates, they're a WIP.  When we have modelers and texture artists to make them, we'll have something to work with.  That said, pirates can cause a great deal of grief.  They steal resources and can cripple ships for an extended period of time.

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June 2, 2013 5:17:15 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Any possibility of adding the Klingon theme from ST:TMP? Would seem to be a nice addition when playing as the Klingons.

 

 

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June 2, 2013 5:47:17 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting psychoak,



They were, they're 50% faster(scale wise) and 25% slower than they used to be.  Initially, halfscale was done at halfscale, across the board.  The complaints of lengthy transit were legitimate, and so were bumper cars fleet battles.  So, weapon ranges and transit speed were bumped back up a bit.
 
What "role" a ship has is largely irrelevant.  The Excelsior is in the long range frigate slot, it is not a long range frigate.  It's not behaving as one either.  It's an early era ship, so it's on the frigate page.  There is some function that remains, such as anti-fighter ships being good for taking down fighters, but the role type is not definitive of the ship.  Their location is relative to their modernity.
 
As for pirates, they're a WIP.  When we have modelers and texture artists to make them, we'll have something to work with.  That said, pirates can cause a great deal of grief.  They steal resources and can cripple ships for an extended period of time.

I saw that you made ships slower. But they have also much accelaration and turning values. It looks like they would be even fighters. 1 Sovereign class had 3.500.000 Metric Tons. It looks for me not realistic when such huge starship turn very fast like it would be a small fighter. Just look at video that you can see how it could be else.

http://youtu.be/nOPYJTy4s0A

I also could read that Constitution class doesn't have any good weapons. But it wasn't also a scout ship. The only scout which you could take would be maybe Hermes class. I think for constitution the best role still is a light frigate like Miranda. It got also several refits and it was the first ship which got refit.

I also agree role is not relevant and there is also not much differences between the starhips. That is also why I didn't change much. I only think that Akira is a better choice for eliteship.

in SOA2 mod no any pirateship can steal resources. That is why I changed it. Anyway every player will be able to defeat them. You can get even more exp. for your eliteships. They dont' t make really troubles. In this mod less then ever. The only disadvantage can be stealing credits. That is why I think they should have this ability at least.

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June 3, 2013 4:19:43 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting myfist0,
I wouldn't mind changing the roles, I like to keep it close to canon and it sounds like you did your homework, but this would cause mass confusion to our long time players and myself, the ship roles are set and not likely to ever change.

 

 

That's all you need to read lol.. they are set in their ways... just make your own version of it. Sometimes a fresh look at things is invaluable ... 

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June 3, 2013 4:37:45 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

I would really love to try out your changes. I too love this mod but think that the ships move a bit unrealistic in turning. Also, I wouldn't mind trying out what you have done with your ships lineup. Let me know how to get in contact with you! I am very interested in seeing what you've done .

 

 

Regards:

 

Treklover

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June 3, 2013 10:52:24 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

I cannot publish it cause I used work of others.

It can be only published when SoA2 Team would accept it. So far it will be only in privat use.

I also am not sure, that I found good solution for constitution class. It had the role of explorer but not scout without any weapons. I will think more about this and looking for a better solution.  Maybe I can find something interesting.

I would like if SoA2 team would take a look at this changes first.

but thx for your interest.

 

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June 3, 2013 11:23:00 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Speaking for myself, I don't see a problem sharing your changes through email within requests of this thread, just don't post it as a mod of your own work.

You can send an archive of your changes to

soa2 at hotmail dot ca

I will look at what you did for the ship speeds and such but don't count on us changing ship roles.

Is this for Reb or Dip?

 

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June 3, 2013 12:07:16 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Changes I made for Rebellion.

I will send you all changes I made but I am still not ready with it. I want to find also a good solution for constitution class.

 

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June 3, 2013 2:38:18 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

The role types for the ships are pretty much irrelevant. Sins AI only requires 3 roletypes to expand. A scout. A Colony capital, or frigate, and a siege frigate. The rest can be pretty much anything. However for the AI to function correctly you must have at least one of every StatCountType. This tells the AI how many units are on the map, and how many more it needs to build for its fleet supply. If we left out a statcounttype then the AI would expand very, or not expand at all.

So we have escort cruisers in a capital ship slot. Explorers in the scout slot. and we arranged everything from oldest to newest. At least in the Feds case, but basically tried to keep it simple so as to not confuse.

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June 3, 2013 3:00:06 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

In my experience the game just crashes without most roletypes.

 

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June 3, 2013 4:11:24 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

I didn' t test the new settings of Federation with AI. I like to play Federation and didn' t give chance AI to play 

But I didn' t change the roles of these ships. I only changed mesh and powers like weapons, shields hull. I changed also abilitiies. That is all. It will not change gameplay only cause of scout maybe. But this is easy to correct.

 

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June 3, 2013 10:09:53 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Major Stress,
The role types for the ships are pretty much irrelevant. Sins AI only requires 3 roletypes to expand. A scout. A Colony capital, or frigate, and a siege frigate. The rest can be pretty much anything. However for the AI to function correctly you must have at least one of every StatCountType. This tells the AI how many units are on the map, and how many more it needs to build for its fleet supply. If we left out a statcounttype then the AI would expand very, or not expand at all.

So we have escort cruisers in a capital ship slot. Explorers in the scout slot. and we arranged everything from oldest to newest. At least in the Feds case, but basically tried to keep it simple so as to not confuse.

 

 

Ahh thanks for the explanation... That clears up a lot.. I was wondering why it seemed like there were so many frigite types and cruiser types when I was always thinking WHY?!?!?!.... Can't you just have less with more rolls lol?

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June 4, 2013 2:07:42 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Major Stress,
The role types for the ships are pretty much irrelevant.

RoleTypes have an influence on the AI's build amounts, and also tells the AI how to use a ship, and in some cases allows it to do special things (like target strikecraft). They are far from irrelevant, imo.

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June 4, 2013 2:53:36 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Major Stress,
The role types for the ships are pretty much irrelevant.

In SOA2, this is very true. Again, SOA2 ships get more advanced as the game progresses and very few of the traditional roles are used as they are in SINS.

 

Quoting Gepard67,
But I didn' t change the roles of these ships. I only changed mesh and powers like weapons, shields hull. I changed also abilitiies.

Sorry, to me, that's changing their roles.

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June 4, 2013 9:28:08 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

What I can see is that AI builds fleets. It depends which ships it is using most. When you make ships which is getting used stronger then it will change maybe balance. I also think that the role type of ships are not so important. That is not the point here.

I was playing it yesterday all day nearly. I don't see any troubles with balance. This mod is for me the best mod ever in balance. When I was playing original game with titans the balance was worse. Sometimes with fleet and capital ships you couldn' t fight just 1 titan. Especially when titan is getting more levels it is nearly impossible to win. I never liked titans from the beginning.

I couldn't win really yesterday. I am getiting one planet, klingons are getting it back, striking one fleet and loosing my eliteships from the attack of another race. It was like a big story. I don' t think that between fleets and ships the balance can become much better. Anyway a little imbalance can be also cause not every empire had the same ships. I have to read the story which empires were really stronger in star trek stories.

The only think I don' t like is that if you don't want to play much, you can crash the opponoents easy when you attack their homeworld. There is no good defences to strike back a good attack. You are getting the homeworld and 2 near of it and have enough recourses to win the game and give the rest to other races. Producers tried to increase the defenses like better starbases. But this makes it also harder to get conquered worlds back. What this game needs is better defenses for homeworld. I only want to change this. Then for me this mod is perfect.

 

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June 4, 2013 11:01:45 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Lavo_2,


Quoting Major Stress, reply 3985The role types for the ships are pretty much irrelevant.

RoleTypes have an influence on the AI's build amounts, and also tells the AI how to use a ship, and in some cases allows it to do special things (like target strikecraft). They are far from irrelevant, imo.

You are correct.

The Role Type tells the AI how the ship behaves in game, and we tried to duplicate the vanilla roletypes in the mod to make sure that the AI doesn't spazz out. You dont have to use roletypes like in vanilla sins. Most mods i see ships use the Light Frigate, or Heavy Cruiser roletype.. In SoA 2 We dont "have" to use the Anti Strike Craft roletype, because all ships have an anti strike craft weapon, and they do use it. Where we DO have to use the roletypes is in the Akira's case. It is an Anti Structure unit. However for it to fire on other ships we had to put the Heavy Cruiser roletype "above" the antistructure roletype. you can mix roletypes with almost any unit It will behave like the roletype that is first on the list. Then the second. So the Akira behaves like a heavy cruiser until there are no ship threats. Then it switches roles and targets structures with its abilitys.

However in this mod, and most other mods the roletypes do not actually determine what a ships actual role is. If that was the case the the Galaxy class would be a true carrier instead of a pocket battleship, and the Defiant would be a support capital instead of an elite escort cruiser.

StatCountType is far more important, because like i said above if your faction is missing any vanilla StatCountType. Then your AI will become lethargic, or not do anything at all, and Ikasumesk is correct. Sometimes you will crash if you are missing a StatCountType. StatCountType is where you must duplicate Vanilla Sins almost exactly.

StatCountType tells the AI how many of a particular unit is on the map at any given time. What units to build, and how many of a that particular unit to build. We used this to help balance the mod out. For example if we put the Defiant in the Light Frigate role, and gave it that StatCountType. The AI would literally build hundreds of them up until the fleet supply runs out. In early builds it was in the Heavy Cruiser slot. Still the AI built a ton of them. Despite playing with costs, and supply numbers. For a ship that powerful we had to find a way to keep the numbers few. So we chose a capital statcounttype. An "Elite" unit. This is why we went "oldest to newest" in filling in the ship slots. Older units are weaker, but are numerous. While newer units are stronger, but fewer in numbers. There are some exceptions in the other factions, but they still balance out.

Geapard all i can say is show your stats to Psychoak, and Fist0. If they think they are an improvement it is up to them to include them into the mod. There isnt much i can do on my end, because of the free time factor.

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June 5, 2013 1:06:02 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Just an observation from an outsider who is not involved in the development of SOA and has followed this thread for about a year and enjoys the mod immensely.

 

The development team has put in a ridiculous amount of time to get this mod to where it is all the while while losing other developers to "real" life. The balancing, the models, the music, fixing bugs, all has come out of their free time. Considering that the proposed changes would affect the basic gameplay (and AI) is probably too much to ask the few left to change. Obviously it's their decision on what to modify at this point but this is an incredible mod (and while not suggesting that there aren't some improvements possible) changes to core gameplay is probably not reasonable at this stage.

 

Just my $.02.

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June 5, 2013 2:28:52 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Work is never done ... besides the missing skins... there should never be a time when someone is DONE with their hobby or love... there is a fine line between perfection and fiddling but, in mods like this that are almost living and breathing there will always need care, love and attention... 

 

 

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June 5, 2013 2:48:43 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Hasn't anyone told you?.... Perfection is the Worst Enemy of Good Enough.

I have seen a lot of mods that settled for nothing less than "perfection".. Those mods were never released. The Bridge Commander mod Favor the Bold was one of those projects i was involved with that failed, because we all were our own worst enemy's. Trying to make it "perfect". The good that came of it is that a lot of those models are in SoA 2. I made the Excelsior, It's variants, and the Constellation specifically for FTB. The Sovereign, and several Dominion models are also from FTB.

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June 5, 2013 4:52:19 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

The search for perfection... I've heard it's motivated a race or too ... I believe Star Fleet Command 2 is out of copy right couldn't you vulture some of their models? 

 

 

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June 5, 2013 8:32:11 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Hello everybody! I'am new to SINS and SOA2. Thank you for this great mod!!! I really enjoy playing it.

I have a few questions...

Maybe the Borg are too powerful? I'm playing with feds. One Dominion AI (Hard) is easy to beat, but against one Borg AI it is impossible for me to win. 

Will there be Skins / Models for the remaining SINS ships?

Will there be better Textures for the Nor-Type Starbase?

One remark to the music with fed: to 80% its perfect, but there are a few elements that don't fit IMHO. Mostly i dont know where they came from, but it sounds like Tron / Mass Effect / some kind of Superhero-Movie Soundtrack...

What do you think about it?

Complaining on a high level, i know.

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June 5, 2013 11:50:45 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Maybe the Borg are too powerful? I'm playing with feds. One Dominion AI (Hard) is easy to beat, but against one Borg AI it is impossible for me to win.

Don't put them in game until you are a very good player. Far from impossible.

 

Will there be Skins / Models for the remaining SINS ships?

As soon as someone makes them.

 

Will there be better Textures for the Nor-Type Starbase?

Again, As soon as someone makes them.

 

One remark to the music with fed: to 80% its perfect, but there are a few elements that don't fit IMHO. Mostly i dont know where they came from, but it sounds like Tron / Mass Effect / some kind of Superhero-Movie Soundtrack...

When you find a Borg planet, it plays part of the Borg theme, does that for all races. They also introduced some music playing from other race while in battle. All fed music is fed, but occasionally you will hear other race music, I'm sure you will survive it.

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June 5, 2013 12:22:37 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Hello myfist0,

thanks for your reply. But nooo, i won´t survive it!!! 

Meanwhile i read that the Borg are OP, an that this was the intention. So everything´s fine. 

Are there any ways to spend money for your Project? I could imagine that many People would do this. 

I would love to see a "perfect" SOA2 in almost every detail (Skins / Textures as mentioned above), but i know that this is a lot of work. Maybe there are a couple of other people who agree with me. I think that i´am not able to support the project in any technical way, like the most players of SOA2 i suppose. So it would be an idea to support the project in a financial way. And if it is only an public Amazon Wishlist. 

Are there any plans or maybe existing projects to translate SOA2 in other languages? So if you or other people have in mind to translate it into german, i can help. My German is far better as my creepy english... 

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June 5, 2013 12:40:06 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Are there any ways to spend money for your Project?

We don't own any of the I.P. and I do not want to waste 5 years in court.

 

Are there any plans or maybe existing projects to translate SOA2 in other languages?

If you wish to help there, feel free.
SOA2/String/English.str

It's a huge file, but if you get through it I will include it with credit to you. As of now, people with an alternate language install needs to rename our string file to their language but it is all still english.

 

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