Ally refusing to attack my enemy they suddenly allied with

from Sins Forums

One of the stars on the map I was playing with CPUs on was contested by me, one ally, and two enemies, both of which were allied only with people on another star. I notice that somehow my Diplomacy level is rising with one of these enemies, even though I've been fighting both of them actively the entire game, and we even made a trade pact. Funny that it should happen, my ally makes a peace treaty with that same enemy. Now even though these two especially were hard at each others necks this entire time, and meanwhile she's bombing a planet of mine, but he'll only fight with pirates and the other guy.

This bothers me. Not just because they allied with each other- but because they were at war this entire game, and he stops supporting me and makes a cease fire with one of our enemies. We had the advantage-it would have have made a lot more sence to kill them both off and take the entire star system for ourselves. I don't expect the CPU to have thought that out, however, I do feel that this is somewhat of a loop hole. If an ally of mine is allied with an enemy, it doesn't seem quite right that me and my enemy keep fighting while he completely ignores us both and sits it out.

Let me chuck my idea out there- if me and a CPU start out allied, shouldn't someone need to ally with both of us in order to achieve a cease fire? Suppose we share the same Diplomacy level with him, or we both need to agree on the cease fire pact first. Say, when I offer the cease fire pact, it will show my allies hands, too and the majority of them would need to agree to it. Not everyone I have a cease fire pact with would suddenly need to agree to it, I imagine. Maybe only allies with the Peace treaty agreement? This would give some insentive to be picky about who I ally with, instead of just sending envoys out and excepting every pact that comes in and letting the CPUs kill each other off.

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Reply #1 from Sins Forums Top

Actually, it's tactically smarter for the 2 enemies to ally with you or your ally, to fight one at a time.  And it's better for the ally of yours to sit it out and let you 2 beat the crap out of eachother, then fight the winners with its fresh unharmed fleet when it's over.  Not that the CPU thought this out, but it's not really a loophole.  THe best you can hope for with a Cease fire with the AI is one less person shooting at you when it counts.

-Exile(\/)

Reply #2 from Sins Forums Top

You have a point there, but I disgree on that being the best tactical move. I think this is mostly because I haven't explained the entire situation. There were three galaxies, one with four CPUs, in two teams, and my galaxy, which had my one ally, and two others, who were each allied to different factions in the other galaxy. The other was entirely unclaimed. I disagree on taking one on at a time- remember that this is 2vs.1vs.1. This means that we both left our borders unprotected to each other and fought both enemies together, who were fighting each other on top of us. This kept them from expanding, so they were both quickly pushed back.

I personally think it would be best, in either of our places, to stay allied. It was 2vs.3vs.3, and I think the best course of action is to clean up the two enemies both of whom are stranded and alone in our galaxy together and then take on the other Galaxy. At this point I would start thinking about how to be ready to mop up the winner. That's just how I wanted to go about doing it- I might have been thinking the same as you if the neither of the other two galaxies were in place, which may have been your understanding.

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Reply #3 from Sins Forums Top

Yeah.  I can see what you're saying now.  I think the AI's parameters for alliance should be altered...and yours too...If you are allied with 2 factions, they should not be giving missions against eachother.

-Exile(\/)

Reply #4 from Sins Forums Top

If you are allied with 2 factions, they should not be giving missions against eachother.
End of quote

I strongly disagree. Just because you're allied with 2 factions doesn't mean they should be allied with each other, and it doesn't mean they shouldn't give you missions against the other.

This way you have an opportunity to pick and choose your allies for the best effect, rather than just allying with whoever and always getting the best deal out of it.

Reply #5 from Sins Forums Top

Realistically, they're going to know who you are allied with, and if you are allied with their enemy, they're not going to be allied with you anymore.  Therefore, a dual alliance for you IS a 3 way alliance on the whole.

Also, as to the best effect, you mean thier "Rewards"?  I hpe not, because i've never had one cred/metal/crystal reward that was worth my time.  I only ally to keep an opponent or 2 off my back while i got after the others.  And, OCCASIONALLY, i get some backup in random battles because my allies fleet stopped by for a few minutes.  Half te time they leave before the battle's even over, but w/e.

-Exile(\/)

Reply #6 from Sins Forums Top

I'm not sure which of you is right. I think it is possible to have good relations with two people, even if they hate each other. I wouldn't say this should be possible in every situation (mine for instance), but having a cease fire treaty I can see as possible.

I do think secretly giving missions to an enemy to attack an ally is an interesting idea. I like it personally. It's a nice way to get at someone who's in my way or threatening me without breaking a cease fire pact prematurely. At a certain point, I think I should be able to see what missions my allies are giving out, so this wouldn't work at all levels, at least without risk. If not that, at least make forfitting this option part of a peace treaty, if it isn't allready.

I think allies are worth more credit then you give them. If nothing else, it is easy to sick them on enemies by giving them a command to attack or defend a planet or giving them a mission. I'm not sure how much the mission motivates them, and you are right about them sometimes leaving during a battle.

Reply #7 from Sins Forums Top

Yes, but i almost never get a response when i tell them to help me out like that.  And when i do, it's just a ship or ten.  Not worth trying to keep on their good side just for that, because their missions distract me from my own goals.

-Exile(\/)