Star shimmer - on a ship?

tl;dr - I want to make a duplicate mesh somehow and use the star distortion to give a race's ships animated, distorted skin in addition to their existing bloom abuse.

Long version -

I'll quickly summarize the concept.


There is a race in my novel who possesses ships made out of an elemental energy-metal. They glow, they have pulsing crimson veins, and they are highly reflective. They also produce distortion - like heat waves - but it's psionic energy.

They are the Undead, and the unique appearance of their ships has been impossible one way or another in every game I've ever modded. But I've always tried to find a compromise to achieve a unique effect.

In sins, I currently have this;

(Ignore the coppery sheen... I'm gonna fix that)

Sins does not have reflections, not even cubemaps, so the reflecitivity is imposible (although I have heard of people breaking the textures to the point of making some kind of reflection, but have never been able to recreate that effect or discover specifics). I can't get 99% of the shaders in Particle Forge to do anything other than render particles invisible. Distortion is also impossible, it seems. But I was looking at a star earlier today and I thought, "Hey, can't particle forge render meshes? Was that not how the B5 guys made the rotating Omega section?"

My idea is simple, but I have doubts if it will work, and I have no idea how to execute it.

The initial idea was to try to spawn a duplicate mesh of the ship that is very slightly larger than the original, and make an animated texture that scrolls and pulses across it for the glowing crimson veins. But perhaps I could take this a step further if I can access the shader used by the star's surface to create that rippling distortion. True distortion for effects doesn't seem like it's at all possible, but if I can give a ship mesh some transparency plus that star animation, well I do quite expect the effect to be very impressive. If I can spawn a second mesh and apply the red veins, we'll be in real business. Since the Undead models are all very low poly (excluding the Fear, but a triple-mesh fear would still only be around 30k poly, hardly anything to be concerned about), I am not at all worried about performance issues (I'm on a beefy computer, anyways). I have done something similar in warcraft 3 to achieve crystalline effects as well as the moving texture effect. I presume that since the Advent Starbase has a shifting texture around the middle that moving textures is possible with particles or in some other shape or form. If not, then we'll ignore the crimson veins. If it is possible, I'd then try to make the crimson veins player color, otherwise the Undead won't have player color. But player color is not a big concern for me since I can't uvw/skin anyway.

There is also that curious shimmering animation played on ship textures during warp. I have another race that could make use of that kind of an effect of that is also possible to access.

But I don't know if this is possible, or how I would go about this.

Grant me your insight, gentlemen. Give in to my madness.

12,453 views 9 replies
Reply #1 Top

The reflective part of a sins mesh 'reflects' the skybox, i.e. an enviroment map. Its controled by the blue channel of the data texture. (-da.dds)

Reply #2 Top

That's glossiness, I believe. I wasn't able to actually see any stars or anything on a model with an extremely high gloss value, just a kind of a shine to it. Not something like a real reflection map, say what X3: Terran Conflict has, anyway. iirc putting a high gloss value on the Undead texture brightened it considerably and produced no notable reflective characteristics. I'll try it again, though.

 

/edit

 

Maxing the gloss and removing the specularity has this effect.

The base texture contains no player color at all, it's just going orange on its own., even from angles where the environment map is "dark". Not exactly the effect I'm looking for...

 

/edit2

 

It's definitely reflecting the environment map but it isn't really reflecting it in the true sense. The lighting doesn't look like it's being considered at all. Even if I turn down the bloom to near non-existent levels the ship remains extremely bright.

Reply #3 Top

Enviroment mapping is a trick, real refelction is too expensive but you can fake it for most situations by putting a texture layer on top that is a static image of the enviroment. As you move the camera around, it moves the texture around giveing the impression of reflection (basicaly).

Its probably a better idea to use it to give a hint of metalic/shine, otherwise - as you saw - it looks kind of silly.

 

No true reflection (as in most games).

Reply #4 Top

Eh, some games are capable of cubemaps at least - that's generally good enough for what I'm after. But I can see why Stardock avoided putting any significant effort into current gen graphics. I'm really pushing the limit on what the engine is set up to do right now.

Well, that's fine, I wasn't expecting to be able to get a nice reflection going.

But what about the skin of distortion? Is that possible?

Reply #5 Top

I think it IS a cube map, however in my 'tests' it was inconclusive wether or not it was simulating reflectivity or not. It certianly got screwed up by bad tangents though, lol.

Reply #6 Top

Well, typically a cubemap would let you determine what is being reflected at least. Well, at least in Halo and some other games it did.

Hmmm... I'm not sure if anyone knows anything about the star shimmer. I might have to poke about the Babylon 5 thread and see if I can find out who specifically did the Omega and throw him an e-mail or something to see how he did that. I speculate I know how to try it, but I'd like to be certain before I go through my whole pipeline with two models.

Reply #7 Top

Hmmm... I'm not sure if anyone knows anything about the star shimmer. I might have to poke about the Babylon 5 thread and see if I can find out who specifically did the Omega and throw him an e-mail or something to see how he did that. I speculate I know how to try it, but I'd like to be certain before I go through my whole pipeline with two models.
End of quote

Here's a thread from a while ago that explains how the rotating ship parts work: https://forums.sinsofasolarempire.com/362008 Specifically, look for the replies from TFL BigBangTheory, as he was the one who discovered/invented the method.

Unfortunately, from my understanding of how it works, you won't be able to get the result you want. As far as I know, it only works with rotating things, like the Omega. But I haven't played around with that too much, so I'm not completely sure.

Reply #8 Top

Thanks!

 

It's a start at least. I also need to make a rotating mesh for a projectile (the Hydra's Plasma Glaive) so at the very least this should point me in the right direction for that.

Reply #9 Top

@IskatuMesk
If you need help with the StarTexture moving, best pm Thoumsin (Fileosoft), he made this with the omega as a testing ground for the Vorlon ships. I'm in the process of getting it going for the Vorlon ship and stumbled upon my own problems.

Cheers