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[Feedback/Request] On Map Version 4 and the aspect of "Chance"

By on June 13, 2012 7:35:05 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Lavo_2

Join Date 05/2010
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With one of the recent release builds of Rebellion, support for map version 3, which did not have the forced moveAreaRadius and hyperspaceExitRadius inserts, was cut. I feel that this lack of support takes much away from making maps.

As version 4 does not allow for the various Random objects to have an moveAreaRadius and hyperspaceExitRadius based off the entity of whatever spawns, taking away an additional form of chance or "randomness". For example, if one puts a WeightedRandom in a map, regardless of spawns, such as an Ice planet or a Dead Asteroid, they will have the same movement area. Plus, nor does it allow, for modders, the ability to put in suns of various sizes with different areas of movement.

Due to these, however futile it may be, I request that either map version 4 has some sort of option to let the moveAreaRadius and hyperspaceExitRadius be left blank or allow for a wildcard symbol (aka. the game loads these values from the planet/star's entity file as in the past), or that map version 3 support be re-added.

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November 13, 2015 9:20:09 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting GoaFan77,


Quoting Lavo_2,






Quoting Wintercross,


My original plan was to make AI versions of each faction (and use the faction selection menu for player and AI versions) that just use frigate variants with alternate versions with the upgrades or something along those lines.



Might I recommend going that route for humans as well from the onset? I'm really unsure as to what features you need for a general ship that capital ships cannot do.



Lots of purchaseable upgrades.



Yup, that was the idea, purchasable upgrades and each ship being able to be named.
The idea being each ship can specialise.

Had actually coded the upgrades for a cruiser that would have given you an option of upgraded armor, long range missile pods or an upgrade to the spinal main gun.

anyways, all of that meant nothing when the change happened way back... if it could be fixed then I could revisit my original plans. 

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November 13, 2015 11:12:35 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Wintercross,
Yup, that was the idea, purchasable upgrades and each ship being able to be named.
The idea being each ship can specialise.

Had actually coded the upgrades for a cruiser that would have given you an option of upgraded armor, long range missile pods or an upgrade to the spinal main gun.

You could always make variants of the capital ship itself, some with more armor, some with more weapons, etc, and make use of all 9 page slots you have avaliable, and even have some resource costing abilities that act as pseudo-upgrades.

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November 13, 2015 9:46:09 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Wintercross,


Quoting MajorVader111,

if i was to request something maybe a option of making weapon styled ability better by adding a option of being able to target a certain direction, example front back left or right, as it is a bit annoying to have a beam ability target and shot at something behind it when the beams are at the front of the ships. If this is possible it would be hopeful in my modding endeavours. 



You can force an ability beam to only fire forwards, though it's not perfect.. just use the "needsToFaceTarget TRUE".

It would be cool to be able to limit the arc of an ability... but it might take a lot of work to do that, since you'd probably need a new buff/ability type.

 

The only issue with that is the whole ship turns to face the target, i don't want that, as the ships i have are quite big, i just want the ship to use its ability where it is targeting a ship in front or to the sides depending where the ability is pointing.

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November 13, 2015 9:56:02 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting DANMAN3712,

Greetings All!


Wow, all the ol' greats are here!  Good to see everyone!

Blair, is the any way to increase the different kinds of weapons, instead of the hardcoded limit?

DANMAN

 

I agree with this too, also to have a feature request, maybe a bit of a bump of the max number of types of weapons on ships, maybe to 7 or 8 perfer 8, depends on how hard it is to do that, its just i want to make ships with a don't mess with me factor and the 5 types of weapons on a ship is just not enough especially with freespace ships. 

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November 14, 2015 3:17:50 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Lavo_2,


Quoting Wintercross,
Yup, that was the idea, purchasable upgrades and each ship being able to be named.
The idea being each ship can specialise.

Had actually coded the upgrades for a cruiser that would have given you an option of upgraded armor, long range missile pods or an upgrade to the spinal main gun.



You could always make variants of the capital ship itself, some with more armor, some with more weapons, etc, and make use of all 9 page slots you have avaliable, and even have some resource costing abilities that act as pseudo-upgrades.



It's not the same though. I still have the system in place, although not as expansive as I originally wanted. At the moment it's just used to change a Battleship into a 'flagship' variant which then changes it into a starbase and allows you to upgrade it.
Of course you can only have one in a grav well at a time due to the afore mentioned hardlimit. 

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November 17, 2015 12:44:13 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Wintercross,


Quoting Lavo_2,






Quoting Wintercross,


Yup, that was the idea, purchasable upgrades and each ship being able to be named.
The idea being each ship can specialise.

Had actually coded the upgrades for a cruiser that would have given you an option of upgraded armor, long range missile pods or an upgrade to the spinal main gun.



You could always make variants of the capital ship itself, some with more armor, some with more weapons, etc, and make use of all 9 page slots you have avaliable, and even have some resource costing abilities that act as pseudo-upgrades.



It's not the same though. I still have the system in place, although not as expansive as I originally wanted. At the moment it's just used to change a Battleship into a 'flagship' variant which then changes it into a starbase and allows you to upgrade it.
Of course you can only have one in a grav well at a time due to the afore mentioned hardlimit. 

 

I agree, and being able to make a "sub titan" out of a Starbase entity would allow us modders even more depth of play for our players.  Basically we will be able to break ships down as follows:

Titan

Sub Titan (Super Capital, Dreadnought, etc.)

Capital

Cruiser

Frigate

Corvette

Fighter

This system will follow a lot of our much loved space games, RTS's, 4X games out there, much like Freespace and Master or Orion, the great games of old.

 

Another really cool request would be able to terraform a planet, and see the change.  Much like the Master of Orion 2 days.  Basically use the same upgrade mesh system as starbase and other upgrades, but apply it to planets.  You can then technically start with a desert world, and through research and terraforming, end up with a Terran or Gaia type world, with much increased stats than what you started.

 

Also, another would be request would be for racial diplomacy.  I wish there was a way to make players love or hate each other based on racial type, not the player.  For instance, in vanilla terms, the TEC would start the game wary of the Vasari, but hating the Advent.  being able to code that into either the playerrace file or some kind of diplomacy file would be great.  This would allow for more storytelling, especially in single player mode.  These loves or hates can be changed of course through diplomacy, favors, etc.  But being able to make a certain race good at relations from the start, and making another race hated by all by default would be really cool indeed.

 

DANMAN

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November 17, 2015 12:53:31 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting DANMAN3712,

Also, another would be request would be for racial diplomacy.  I wish there was a way to make players love or hate each other based on racial type, not the player.  For instance, in vanilla terms, the TEC would start the game wary of the Vasari, but hating the Advent.  being able to code that into either the playerrace file or some kind of diplomacy file would be great.  This would allow for more storytelling, especially in single player mode.  These loves or hates can be changed of course through diplomacy, favors, etc.  But being able to make a certain race good at relations from the start, and making another race hated by all by default would be really cool indeed.

You CAN do that in Rebellion already. Have you ever tried to ally with the Advent or Vasari as TEC Rebels. 

Quoting DANMAN3712,

Another really cool request would be able to terraform a planet, and see the change.  Much like the Master of Orion 2 days.  Basically use the same upgrade mesh system as starbase and other upgrades, but apply it to planets.  You can then technically start with a desert world, and through research and terraforming, end up with a Terran or Gaia type world, with much increased stats than what you started.

 

This is one of the main reason we asked for (and got thanks to Blair ) a destroy planet buff. The same striped to the core system that is used to blow up a planet can also be used to upgrade it if you wished to do that instead.

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November 17, 2015 1:00:46 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting GoaFan77,


Quoting DANMAN3712,

Also, another would be request would be for racial diplomacy.  I wish there was a way to make players love or hate each other based on racial type, not the player.  For instance, in vanilla terms, the TEC would start the game wary of the Vasari, but hating the Advent.  being able to code that into either the playerrace file or some kind of diplomacy file would be great.  This would allow for more storytelling, especially in single player mode.  These loves or hates can be changed of course through diplomacy, favors, etc.  But being able to make a certain race good at relations from the start, and making another race hated by all by default would be really cool indeed.



You CAN do that in Rebellion already. Have you ever tried to ally with the Advent or Vasari as TEC Rebels. 

But not the way I want it.  Basically, in 7DS for example, we have 10 races.  Some of those races I want to be Xenophobic from the very start of the game, and hate every other race, except themselves.  If they run into a player of the same race, they would befriend them, but will want to war with all the rest.  I also want some races to love everyone, and be loved by everyone.  That kind of thing, which harkens back to the old Master of Orion days, where picking certain races would mean you would be hated by other races automatically.

Quoting DANMAN3712,

Another really cool request would be able to terraform a planet, and see the change.  Much like the Master of Orion 2 days.  Basically use the same upgrade mesh system as starbase and other upgrades, but apply it to planets.  You can then technically start with a desert world, and through research and terraforming, end up with a Terran or Gaia type world, with much increased stats than what you started.

 



This is one of the main reason we asked for (and got thanks to Blair ) a destroy planet buff. The same striped to the core system that is used to blow up a planet can also be used to upgrade it if you wished to do that instead.

Yes, but that would not work for my idea unless you can do that again and again.  If that CAN occur, then this would be what I wanted.  To be able to see a step by step change in the planet, and change its stats with every step.

 

Good to see you are reading my ideas GoaFan, good to see you too 

 

DANMAN

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November 17, 2015 1:25:04 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

You could theoretically, but you would have to sacrifice the ability to destroy planets... if you made the stripped to the core definitions in reverse, you could for example do something like: Asteroid -> Barren World -> Desert world -> Terran World 

But stripped to the core would become terraforming. So you would no longer be able to reduce a planet to resources =P


Unless the ability based version allows you to define the effects. 

:edit: to make it a bit clearer, each planet entity file has a definition for what it turns into when STTC is used on it. Regular planets turn into asteroids by default I believe, and asteroids become asteroid fields I think... or something like that.

So you could go into each planets entity file and change that to work in the opposite direction, make each planet turn into a 'nicer' one up when STTC is used. However the planet would probably still need to be recolonised each time you did that too.

 

:EDIT2:

Here we go, this is the part from the asteroid entity:

planetRuinDef
ruinPlanetType "PlanetAsteroidBelt"
attachType "Center"
effectName "StripToTheCore_Planet_Asteroid"
startTime 9.000000
soundID "EFFECT_STRIPPEDTOTHECORE"
creditsOnStrippedToTheCore 2000.000000
metalOnStrippedToTheCore 750.000000
crystalOnStrippedToTheCore 250.000000
extraScuttleTimeOnStrip 0.000000



I believe, though I'm not 100% certain, that you could make those resource numbers negative to make it cost to 'strip'/terraform... though I haven't actually tried it myself.

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November 17, 2015 2:03:28 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting DANMAN3712,

But not the way I want it.  Basically, in 7DS for example, we have 10 races.  Some of those races I want to be Xenophobic from the very start of the game, and hate every other race, except themselves.  If they run into a player of the same race, they would befriend them, but will want to war with all the rest.  I also want some races to love everyone, and be loved by everyone.  That kind of thing, which harkens back to the old Master of Orion days, where picking certain races would mean you would be hated by other races automatically.

I am still not following why this could not be done already. You can set a specific bonus or penalty a faction gets to every other faction in the race.entity file. A Xenophobic race could have large negative modifiers for every other faction. This is basically what the TEC Rebels already have. Others like the Vasari Rebels could be made more cooperative towards everyone (you do seem to be in a bit of a logical bind of what happens when a xenophobic race meets a popular one, but I don't see what could help you in that situation).

In addition, for races that are supposed to have very good Diplomacy, you could give them the relation research modifiers at the start of the game.

I currently have 9 factions and they all have customized starting diplomatic values towards each other, based on the lore of how likely they would be to ally.

Quoting Wintercross,

You could theoretically, but you would have to sacrifice the ability to destroy planets... if you made the stripped to the core definitions in reverse, you could for example do something like: Asteroid -> Barren World -> Desert world -> Terran World 

But stripped to the core would become terraforming. So you would no longer be able to reduce a planet to resources =P

This exactly. Mods may choose to allow destroying planets, or terminating them. It is unfortunate you cannot have both, but that is infinitely better than what we have know, and it seems rude to complain over getting an ability to be able to do this when we couldn't reliably do either before. 

We might even be able to teach the AI to destroy and terraform planets now, which was totally impossible before.

Quoting Wintercross,

I believe, though I'm not 100% certain, that you could make those resource numbers negative to make it cost to 'strip'/terraform... though I haven't actually tried it myself.

Once we get the ability to change planets, by far the most sensible thing would be to make the Terraform ability itself cost resources. That way, you could not actually attempt to terraform until you have the money. Even if negative resources did work, you could still try to do it if you are broke.

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November 17, 2015 3:49:01 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting GoaFan77,


Quoting DANMAN3712,

But not the way I want it.  Basically, in 7DS for example, we have 10 races.  Some of those races I want to be Xenophobic from the very start of the game, and hate every other race, except themselves.  If they run into a player of the same race, they would befriend them, but will want to war with all the rest.  I also want some races to love everyone, and be loved by everyone.  That kind of thing, which harkens back to the old Master of Orion days, where picking certain races would mean you would be hated by other races automatically.



I am still not following why this could not be done already. You can set a specific bonus or penalty a faction gets to every other faction in the race.entity file. A Xenophobic race could have large negative modifiers for every other faction. This is basically what the TEC Rebels already have. Others like the Vasari Rebels could be made more cooperative towards everyone (you do seem to be in a bit of a logical bind of what happens when a xenophobic race meets a popular one, but I don't see what could help you in that situation).

In addition, for races that are supposed to have very good Diplomacy, you could give them the relation research modifiers at the start of the game.

I currently have 9 factions and they all have customized starting diplomatic values towards each other, based on the lore of how likely they would be to ally.

 

Yeah, he's right Danman.

I was poking around that stuff myself recently for SotSS... you just have to open up each player.entity and define relationship modifiers for each race within it. The default Rebellion obviously is only set up for the vanllia races, but it is pretty easy to alter it.

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November 17, 2015 9:30:29 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Wintercross,


Quoting GoaFan77,






Quoting DANMAN3712,



But not the way I want it.  Basically, in 7DS for example, we have 10 races.  Some of those races I want to be Xenophobic from the very start of the game, and hate every other race, except themselves.  If they run into a player of the same race, they would befriend them, but will want to war with all the rest.  I also want some races to love everyone, and be loved by everyone.  That kind of thing, which harkens back to the old Master of Orion days, where picking certain races would mean you would be hated by other races automatically.



I am still not following why this could not be done already. You can set a specific bonus or penalty a faction gets to every other faction in the race.entity file. A Xenophobic race could have large negative modifiers for every other faction. This is basically what the TEC Rebels already have. Others like the Vasari Rebels could be made more cooperative towards everyone (you do seem to be in a bit of a logical bind of what happens when a xenophobic race meets a popular one, but I don't see what could help you in that situation).

In addition, for races that are supposed to have very good Diplomacy, you could give them the relation research modifiers at the start of the game.

I currently have 9 factions and they all have customized starting diplomatic values towards each other, based on the lore of how likely they would be to ally.






 

Yeah, he's right Danman.

I was poking around that stuff myself recently for SotSS... you just have to open up each player.entity and define relationship modifiers for each race within it. The default Rebellion obviously is only set up for the vanllia races, but it is pretty easy to alter it.

 

Then that is AWESOME, I was not aware of all the stuff in there already.  I never really got into all the Diplomacy DLC stuff, I have always been busy trying to convert 7DS to keep up, and I just glanced by Diplomacy.

 

Thank you GeoFan77 and Wintercross for clearing that up for me.  Then I guess we can check that off the wanted list then!

 

I hope we get the Starbase thing you are asking for Wintercross....because then I can implement my idea to build "planets".  Basically Starbases reskinned as planets, which of course you can then destroy, terraform, etc.  If they can"unlock" the starbases like before, that would really help both my idea and yours.

 

It would take my original Solar Sins mod to a WHOLE another level.

 

DANMAN 

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November 22, 2015 3:51:53 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Is there anyway you guys could find a way to allow more than a single faction change. It could allow for some interesting tech options to allow multiple branches within a faction. Even a "If Unlocked then "Insert_Research_Name_Here" Unavailable" option would add some serious complexity to a tech tree. 

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November 22, 2015 5:55:33 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Lord_Set,

Is there anyway you guys could find a way to allow more than a single faction change. It could allow for some interesting tech options to allow multiple branches within a faction. Even a "If Unlocked then "Insert_Research_Name_Here" Unavailable" option would add some serious complexity to a tech tree. 

So you've tried doing multiple faction changes? Just looking at the files I don't see why you couldn't do this. It just gets very annoying to do since the number of factions and thus research you need goes up very quickly.

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November 25, 2015 7:14:59 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Since this has turned in some kind of wishlist, would it be possible to improve abilitys for squads/figthers? Like "ApplyBuffToTarget" or "ApplyBuffToSelf" so the squad can start a unique attack or improve itself for a period of time. Something like that would be awesome.

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November 27, 2015 1:08:12 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Madriel,

Since this has turned in some kind of wishlist, would it be possible to improve abilitys for squads/figthers? Like "ApplyBuffToTarget" or "ApplyBuffToSelf" so the squad can start a unique attack or improve itself for a period of time. Something like that would be awesome.

You can already achieve an ApplyBuffToSelf by putting an ability on the host ship with ApplyBuffToTargetsLinked.

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November 27, 2015 3:35:21 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Lavo_2,


Quoting Madriel,

Since this has turned in some kind of wishlist, would it be possible to improve abilitys for squads/figthers? Like "ApplyBuffToTarget" or "ApplyBuffToSelf" so the squad can start a unique attack or improve itself for a period of time. Something like that would be awesome.



You can already achieve an ApplyBuffToSelf by putting an ability on the host ship with ApplyBuffToTargetsLinked.

Yeah, but you cannot always reliably put a buff to the host ship from the fighter squad itself.

It would be much better if the squads could just apply a buff to all fighters in the squad.

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November 30, 2015 3:51:41 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Hello, well I would like to ask for AI using phase jump for Star Bases at least with  "StarBasesCanHyperspace" researchModifier, as it was in previous versions.

Thanks

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December 1, 2015 8:51:30 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Few more desires)

Is it possible to have a research modifier that limits number of colonies allowed?

And could you add "FriendlyWithPirates" research bool modifier just to become friends with pirates and stay everyone else hostile, please

Thanks

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December 2, 2015 6:58:28 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Aplos,

Few more desires)

Is it possible to have a research modifier that limits number of colonies allowed?

And could you add "FriendlyWithPirates" research bool modifier just to become friends with pirates and stay everyone else hostile, please

Thanks


You mean friendly with pirates but hostile to militia? If so I'm down with that. 

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December 2, 2015 11:41:43 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Aplos,
And could you add "FriendlyWithPirates" research bool modifier just to become friends with pirates and stay everyone else hostile, please

I don't think this is even possible; pirates and militia are both expressly designated as neutrals, which is how the TEC Rebels' modifier works.

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December 2, 2015 6:57:40 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Lavo_2,


Quoting Aplos,
And could you add "FriendlyWithPirates" research bool modifier just to become friends with pirates and stay everyone else hostile, please



I don't think this is even possible; pirates and militia are both expressly designated as neutrals, which is how the TEC Rebels' modifier works.



Yeah, it would likely require a new 'faction' type. Kind of like the 'MadVasari' we got in the DLC. IF they did do it would be cool though.

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December 2, 2015 9:01:30 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

I would like to see shielded strike craft... 

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December 3, 2015 7:37:25 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Canitbedude123,

I would like to see shielded strike craft... 


If we wanna go crazy I'd love to be able to have corvettes in squadrons that can phase jump =P

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December 4, 2015 8:10:37 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Lavo_2,


Quoting Aplos,
And could you add "FriendlyWithPirates" research bool modifier just to become friends with pirates and stay everyone else hostile, please



I don't think this is even possible; pirates and militia are both expressly designated as neutrals, which is how the TEC Rebels' modifier works.

Looks like it is easily possible, as in GalaxyScenarioDef we have possible player type definitions:

Militia:

    isNormalPlayer FALSE
    isRaidingPlayer FALSE
    isInsurgentPlayer FALSE
    isOccupationPlayer FALSE
    isMadVasariPlayer FALSE

Pirates:

    isNormalPlayer FALSE
    isRaidingPlayer TRUE
    isInsurgentPlayer FALSE
    isOccupationPlayer FALSE
    isMadVasariPlayer FALSE

MadVasari:

    isNormalPlayer FALSE
    isRaidingPlayer FALSE
    isInsurgentPlayer FALSE
    isOccupationPlayer FALSE
    isMadVasariPlayer TRUE

...

That's how the game knows how to use different players

 

So we simply need to be allied with Pirate Player and hostile with everyone else

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