Sins of a Solar Empire : Real-Time Strategy. Unrivalled Scale.
© 2003-2016 Ironclad Games Corporation Vancouver, BC. All rights reserved.
© 2006-2016 Stardock Entertainment

Will this game ever come out with a non steam version like Fallen Enchantress?

By on December 29, 2012 3:41:45 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

doomBlackDr...

Join Date 12/2006
0

I bot the original Sins of a Solar Empire.  Because they started to shocked the steam DRM BS down our throat. I also remember them saying they will never force use to play their games on steam. *Looks at stardocks and calls them hipercrits. Yet when I bot the original Elemental: War of Magic it was so bad they gave me a free copy of Elemental: Fallen Enchatress. Would you look at that. A new game that is not forcing Steam down my throat.

 

Yes that is right. I am playing Fallen Enchantress with out steam and getting updates through StarDock Central. So with this great new thing. It has giving me much hope that they might do the same for their other games. So like the the title says. Will this game get a non steam version?

Locked Post 53 Replies
Search this post
Subscription Options


Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
December 29, 2012 8:22:54 AM from Stardock Forums Stardock Forums

I understand Sins Rebellion requires Steam as it uses SteamWorks for a number of features.

Because of this I would not expect a non Steam version.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
December 29, 2012 9:26:26 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

A number of features? Are these features for the 25 people that play multi-player? Sins has primarily always been a single player game with a pile doing private LAN games. What of these 'features' are for these people?

 

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
December 29, 2012 6:42:04 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Supposedly Steamworks has a lot of awesome features that games can use but I just haven't seen any new online features aside from inviting people through Steam friends list (we could already invite through ICO friends list IIRC) and everyone now being able to see our Achievements (which can be laughably easy to get if you mod the game).

I don't see how those are so vital to our enjoyment as to force Steamworks upon us and we don't even get the awesome stuff like Steam Workshop, so even as someone who uses Steam for a lot of games I'm not happy with the change.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
December 30, 2012 6:41:09 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting myfist0,
A number of features? Are these features for the 25 people that play multi-player?
You know. There are well over a thousand people online in Sins these days. Just sayin'. And a lot of these people got their asses online due to Steam.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
December 31, 2012 5:52:21 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Teun-A-Roonius,

Quoting myfist0, reply 2A number of features? Are these features for the 25 people that play multi-player?You know. There are well over a thousand people online in Sins these days. Just sayin'. And a lot of these people got their asses online due to Steam.

Congrats again for defending the street-corner pimp.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
January 1, 2013 2:39:20 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Edit: Misunderstood your reply Semaz, my bad. After re-reading this your comment looks more like a joke than an insult, so I will interpret it as such. My sincere apologies for the earlier rage reply!

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
January 7, 2013 3:04:33 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

 

I just one of those people who owns the original trilogy and is a bit ticked off that they expect me to rebuy the game to use their steam client. With the Fact the Fallen Enchantress has a non steam version on top of steam version.

Quoting Neil Banfield,
I understand Sins Rebellion requires Steam as it uses SteamWorks for a number of features.

Because of this I would not expect a non Steam version.

 

You know that those features are? DRM. That right. They are calling you a theif and a pirate. So they have to shove DRM down your throat.

Which I am one who does not submite to game companies tring to cheat me. Sure some people are more then willing to be ripped off and cheated by game companies.

 

Yet when a companies makes deals with me. I expect them to keep their end of the deal.

 

The deal was. I buy their game. In return the do not force steam down my throat. Ok I can forgive them for putting their items on steam on top of their impulse. I how ever can not forgive them for tring to force me to use steam. Specially like I said many times. I own a non steam version of Fallen Enchantress. Which also comes in a steam version. So please do not feed me that bull. That it needs steam to run.

 

It does not require steam to run. The Steam DRM needs steam to run. This is why you have to have an internet connection to boot up steam.

 

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
January 7, 2013 4:13:46 PM from Stardock Forums Stardock Forums

Quoting doomBlackDragon,
I own a non steam version of Fallen Enchantress. Which also comes in a steam version.

Fallen Enchantress is sold via Steam but there is no "Steam Version". It's the same version you get anywhere, which is why it isn't dependent upon Steam.

Rebellion, on the other hand, uses the Steamworks library to provide various pieces of functionality.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
January 8, 2013 8:20:29 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Just out of curiosity, why did they choose to switch to steam?  Is Impulse dead or something?  Rebellion is literally the only steam game I have, I got steam just to get it.  All the steam hate seems a little excessive, but I would like to know why the choice was made...

-Huzzah!

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
January 8, 2013 8:34:43 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Twilight_Storm,
Just out of curiosity, why did they choose to switch to steam? 

interesting question 2 devs tried to answer.

Quoting Neil Banfield,
Steam as it uses SteamWorks for a number of features.

 

and another

Quoting kryo,
to provide various pieces of functionality.

 

They would make great politicians 

 

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
January 8, 2013 10:54:21 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Probably achievements...

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
January 8, 2013 1:37:43 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Achievements, Steam Cloud, and inviting people off your Steam friends list?

Yeah, those are all really vital features for enhanced enjoyment of Rebellion.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
January 8, 2013 3:19:50 PM from Stardock Forums Stardock Forums

There's lot of features in Steamworks, some are more obvious than others and some are to benefit the developers as such.

http://www.steampowered.com/steamworks/

I think you want exact answers but those decisions made by devs, producers, ceo, etc. really aren't going to be made public here.

Personally, the popularity of Steam and the demand seen for it is a good reason enough.

 

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
January 8, 2013 4:41:55 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

It's practical, cheap and good for sales for game companies. Yeah we consumers knows that. That doesn't stop many consumers from disliking steam. Therefore the question "Is there a non steam version?" will continue being asked by consumers every time a none Valve game go on steam.

 

Obviously I'm one of those that dislike steam. I tolerate it but if there's a non steam version I chose that.

 

Oh and the only really good reason for consumers to have to use steam I have ever heard is that the games tend to be cheaper. Notice "really good" and "tend". Most other positive things with it is either not very important, small or is diminished  by the steam client itself.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
January 8, 2013 5:17:19 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Thanks for answering Island Dog.  Even if we can't get specifics.

-Huzzah!

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
January 9, 2013 2:36:10 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Moving to Steam was one of the best things that ever happened for this game.  Did I mention that online player counts peaked over 1000 at a single point in time after the recent $14 Steam sale?

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
January 9, 2013 4:25:18 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

I've yet to see over fifty, but haven't checked in a couple months. 

-Huzzah!

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
January 9, 2013 7:49:02 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting DirtySanchezz,
Moving to Steam was one of the best things that ever happened for this game.  Did I mention that online player counts peaked over 1000 at a single point in time after the recent $14 Steam sale?

Selling the game over Steam without the draconian DRM and TOS would have accomplished the same thing.

DOH!

http://store.steampowered.com/subscriber_agreement/

6. USER GENERATED INFORMATION

"User Generated Information" means any information made available to other users through your use of multi-user features of Steam or to Valve or its affiliates through your use of the Software or otherwise. User Generated Information may include, but is not limited to, chat, forum posts, screen names, game selections, player performances, usage data, suggestions about Valve products or services, and error notifications. Subject to the Valve privacy policy referenced in Section 1 above, as applicable, and except as otherwise specifically addressed in any Subscription Terms or Rules of Use, you expressly grant Valve and its affiliates the non-exclusive, irrevocable right to use, reproduce, modify, create derivative works from, distribute, transmit, broadcast, and otherwise communicate, and publicly display and perform the User Generated Information and derivative works thereof in any form, anywhere, with or without attribution to you, and without any notice or compensation to you of any kind. For any content for which you take advantage of cloud storage provided by Valve, you grant us a license to store such information for you, and you represent and warrant to us that you have sufficient rights in such content to grant us this license. You acknowledge and agree that we may place limits on the amount of storage you may use.

C. NO GUARANTEES.

NEITHER VALVE NOR ITS AFFILIATES GUARANTEE CONTINUOUS, ERROR-FREE, VIRUS-FREE OR SECURE OPERATION AND ACCESS TO STEAM, THE SOFTWARE, YOUR ACCOUNT AND/OR YOUR SUBSCRIPTIONS(S) OR ANY INFORMATION AVAILABLE IN CONNECTION THEREWITH.

C. Termination by Valve.

Valve may cancel your Account or any particular Subscription(s) at any time. In the event that your Account or a particular Subscription is terminated or cancelled by Valve for a violation of this Agreement or 
improper (<-- WTF is that    ) or illegal activity, no refund, including of any Subscription fees, will be granted.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
January 9, 2013 11:06:19 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Hater.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
January 9, 2013 4:59:56 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting DirtySanchezz,
Moving to Steam was one of the best things that ever happened for this game.  Did I mention that online player counts peaked over 1000 at a single point in time after the recent $14 Steam sale?

 

Nobody has anything against them offering it on Steam.

 

What rightfully pisses people is that you are forced to use Steam.

 

At which point all he states here and more comes into play.

Quoting myfist0,

Quoting Twilight_Storm, reply 18Moving to Steam was one of the best things that ever happened for this game.  Did I mention that online player counts peaked over 1000 at a single point in time after the recent $14 Steam sale?

Selling the game over Steam without the draconian DRM and TOS would have accomplished the same thing.

DOH!

http://store.steampowered.com/subscriber_agreement/


6. USER GENERATED INFORMATION

"User Generated Information" means any information made available to other users through your use of multi-user features of Steam or to Valve or its affiliates through your use of the Software or otherwise. User Generated Information may include, but is not limited to, chat, forum posts, screen names, game selections, player performances, usage data, suggestions about Valve products or services, and error notifications. Subject to the Valve privacy policy referenced in Section 1 above, as applicable, and except as otherwise specifically addressed in any Subscription Terms or Rules of Use, you expressly grant Valve and its affiliates the non-exclusive, irrevocable right to use, reproduce, modify, create derivative works from, distribute, transmit, broadcast, and otherwise communicate, and publicly display and perform the User Generated Information and derivative works thereof in any form, anywhere, with or without attribution to you, and without any notice or compensation to you of any kind. For any content for which you take advantage of cloud storage provided by Valve, you grant us a license to store such information for you, and you represent and warrant to us that you have sufficient rights in such content to grant us this license. You acknowledge and agree that we may place limits on the amount of storage you may use.

C. NO GUARANTEES.

NEITHER VALVE NOR ITS AFFILIATES GUARANTEE CONTINUOUS, ERROR-FREE, VIRUS-FREE OR SECURE OPERATION AND ACCESS TO STEAM, THE SOFTWARE, YOUR ACCOUNT AND/OR YOUR SUBSCRIPTIONS(S) OR ANY INFORMATION AVAILABLE IN CONNECTION THEREWITH.

C. Termination by Valve.

Valve may cancel your Account or any particular Subscription(s) at any time. In the event that your Account or a particular Subscription is terminated or cancelled by Valve for a violation of this Agreement or 
improper (<-- WTF is that    ) or illegal activity, no refund, including of any Subscription fees, will be granted.

 

 

Quoting Teun-A-Roonius,
Hater.

 

Better than Steam lovers who poison the entire market with such a fundamentally wrong concept. 

 

Or would you go to a car dealer and give him 10000 € for the permission to drive one of his cars? A permission he can revoke at ANY time without fear of any disadvantages for him? No, of course not. You may do that for 100 €... or even less.

 

For 10000 € you expect to own the car and to do with it whatever you please whenever you please. Of course you have to abide to the common sense and to the law, but thats about it.

 

Or to go back to games sold the classic way or at least games without steam or something similar.

 

I am a reasonable being. I do fully understand that the developer dont wants me to burn copies and give them to my friends for free or to upload it to the internet alltogether. That is a very reasonable wish and so I feel the need to honor it.

 

But as a developer, please do understand as well, that I have the same reasonable wish to own a copy. One that does work, long after Steam or Stardock (which I really hope I will never see of course!)  has gone bankrupt.

 

Right now my only gurantee to play Sins Rebellion as long as I wish is

a. The way of illegal download

b. Stardocks continued existence... which is not guranteed to be eternal. (Again, I really like Stardock (after all I tolerated Steam just for you) and I really dont wish them anything harmful. But contrary to all our wishes they may go out of business one day. Imagine a car that stops working the moment the factory who is building it goes bankrupt. Sounds like a bad idea, huh? Especially if said car cost the same as a competitors car that has no such problems.

 

Let me get this very straight. I love Sins. I love Rebellion. But the rights I have on this game via Steam, are basically nonexistant.

 

For such little value, I am not ready to pay more than 2 Dollars for a new game - On release day.

 

I have no ill feelings against Valve, but I really wish that they go bankrupt one day. Because only then all those foolish Steam lovers would realize they did nothing more than rent the games they so silly refer to be bought on Steam.

 

And dont come me with "There will be a Non Steam patch" shit. For current games. yes, but for anything older than 1 year i would have very little hope. Ohh, but you could buy the successor - for just 60 €. Want the old game too... ohh just 120 €.

 

 

So for now... I can tolerate Steam.... but it leaves a bad feeling and I would congratulate Stardock on offering their game on Steam in the future... as it indeed brought a lot of sales and new people in. But please dont force it upon people who dislike it. You are considerable testing their patience..... not a wise thing to do to any customer.  

 

 

 

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
January 9, 2013 5:46:10 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

I'm afraid Steam users now make up more than 90% of total sales volume by our estimates. For those hoping that there will be 'non-Steam' versions of anything in the future, it would take something fantastically major for that to occur.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
January 9, 2013 5:47:52 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

I went to the Steam forum about a thread on their TOS, it was deleted along with all the others, merged into a single thread. The moderators stated this will be the only place you will be allowed to comment on the TOS, then CLOSED THE THREAD.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
January 9, 2013 10:24:55 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Why does that quote myfist0 posted have my name on it?  That was dirtysanchez, not me............

Quoting ARESIV,

So for now... I can tolerate Steam.... but it leaves a bad feeling and I would congratulate Stardock on offering their game on Steam in the future... as it indeed brought a lot of sales and new people in. But please dont force it upon people who dislike it. You are considerable testing their patience..... not a wise thing to do to any customer. 
 

Agreed.  I don't care that it's on steam, but making it steam-exclusive is a terrible tactical choice as far as sales go.

However, It has dawned on me that the move to steam in general may have been an attempt to actually revive the MP portion of this game, which according to some, it have accomplished, so overall, at least they were attempting to better their product with the move.

-Huzzah!

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
January 9, 2013 10:39:02 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Its not that I love Steam ARES, its just that it isn't as evil as some people here seem to think it is. Its just a freaking company like any other for Chrissake.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
January 9, 2013 11:36:01 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Twilight_Storm,
Why does that quote myfist0 posted have my name on it?  That was dirtysanchez, not me............

 

Not sure. Be sure it was unintentional. I will fix. 

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
Stardock Forums v1.0.0.0    #101114  walnut1   Server Load Time: 00:00:00.0000219   Page Render Time: