Sins of a Solar Empire : Real-Time Strategy. Unrivalled Scale.
© 2003-2016 Ironclad Games Corporation Vancouver, BC. All rights reserved.
© 2006-2016 Stardock Entertainment

I have heard that Flak frigates are the strongest

By on June 9, 2014 12:15:07 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

WJC3688

Join Date 09/2008
+3

Recent developments have brought it to my attention that Flak frigates may be the most powerful in this game. They have a lot of hp and guns, actually 4 guns I noticed even though regular frigates only get one gun. The idea I have heard is that a blob of Flak frigates moving into the middle of the enemy long range frigates will fire all 4 guns and kill them. Another idea I have heard is that the Flak frigates can be queued to run circles forever, preventing enemy ships from shooting at them. Can anyone confirm?

Locked Post 48 Replies
Search this post
Subscription Options


Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
June 13, 2014 3:32:11 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting WJC3688,
10 Cobalts vs 1 Akkan (level 1 w/ colonize and a fighter squad)

 

Was anything upgraded on either side?

What were the targeting orders?

Did you retreat wounded units or was it a fight till death?  EDIT: I mean move them out of enemy fire range.

You forgot to mention the most important detail, what was the positioning of the Akkan and where were the Cobalts? Were the Cobalts or the capital ship ever repositioning?

Quoting WJC3688,
12 Javelis vs 1 Akkan

Same info missing here.. This is a critical detail.

Quoting WJC3688,
12 Garda vs 1 Akkan

 

Yeah we already knew Capital ships at lower levels are not that good against Flak because of their higher hit points. You can even feel it when you are colonizing with the Akkan, it takes quite some time getting rid of the flak frigates, that's why people just leave them there and buiild a turret.

Quoting WJC3688,
What do you think?

Gardas are meant to counter carriers hard, but were squadrons already built or did they just start building it while under attack?

Quoting WJC3688,
I didn't realize until it was nearly over that the fighters on the Percheron side were stupidly attacking the Akkan and ignoring its fighter squadron,

 

Fighters for a strange reason have a stupid attack priority system, foe example when you jump in on an asteroid, the fighter wing many times targets the Cobalt, against which it is extremely poor. Or many times if it's a bigger planet THE GARDAS, lol, extremely poor choice, why not Krosov or LRM instead?

Kiting is very effective, and does not really need much experience to pull it off, even works against orkies but once it catches up lol..

Quoting WJC3688,
All food for thought regarding small size fleet engagements. And another myth perpetuated by the Anti-Flak lobby successfully debunked (that capitalships somehow "counter" Flak..... certain capitals could beat them, more than likely, but this would likely be due to abilities that just make them powerful against any type of frigates, or against anything in general, like the Kortul's incredibly dumb self-healing abilities that make it unkillable in very small size fleets like these).

Can you give us TIME? How long did it take each battle to finish? My guess is the Garda one took forever. More importantly, for these tests to have any real value, you should upload the videos of them........... For this time we can only trust your word on these, even if we don't have every imporant detail.

Quoting RespawnedTitanL10,
If I were to venture a guess, it might be because there is a very high level of variation in outcomes (from the same starting OOB) depending on relatively obscure maneuvering details that are hard to grasp outside a sandbox.

Yes this is my main concern as well, these tests look good in a laboratorical environment, but against any human opponent these fights just simply does not exist.

In theory flak spam may sound good, but by the time you achieve this, you are already crushed. Flak takes an extremely long time to be built, cost crystal and more credits, needs lvl2 research, and better players will just focus some LF's on them to get rid of earlier, and there goes your weaker fleet.

 

 

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
June 13, 2014 5:49:13 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Lol itsfun to see turchany work himself up into a knot to try and defend his ramblings...

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
June 13, 2014 10:48:38 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Turchany,


Quoting WJC3688, reply 2310 Cobalts vs 1 Akkan (level 1 w/ colonize and a fighter squad)

 

Was anything upgraded on either side?

What were the targeting orders?

Did you retreat wounded units or was it a fight till death?  EDIT: I mean move them out of enemy fire range.

You forgot to mention the most important detail, what was the positioning of the Akkan and where were the Cobalts? Were the Cobalts or the capital ship ever repositioning?

 

All of these were with no research. There were no "targeting orders"...... the Cobalts only have 1 thing to shoot at, and the Akkan cannot "focus fire" as it is a single unit. I did not attempt any micro on either side, for now I am more interested in seeing "base" outcomes with auto-attacks before attempting to do advanced micro. Any micro that I performed was mentioned in the descriptions, if there was no mention of micro, none occurred. If I had to venture a guess, the Akkan might have gotten mileage out of run-through micro, but not as much as say Gardas due to its incredibly slow turn rate. Likewise the cobalts could fight more efficiently by running the nearly-dead frigates out of the gravity well, but these would likely not be able to re-join the fight in time to make a big difference.



Yeah we already knew Capital ships at lower levels are not that good against Flak because of their higher hit points. You can even feel it when you are colonizing with the Akkan, it takes quite some time getting rid of the flak frigates, that's why people just leave them there and buiild a turret.

 

And yet in the past you listed capital ships as a counter to Flak. Now you attempt to de-value the results by saying "yea we already knew that, so what?" A glimpse into the convenient side-switching tactics of the Anti-Flak Lobby.


Gardas are meant to counter carriers hard, but were squadrons already built or did they just start building it while under attack?

I made sure the squads were pre-built. It would be pretty silly to have the carriers fighting with no strike craft ready yet, that would only be realistic if you were building them at a world already under siege, in which case you would obv. just build conventional combat frigates to defend, not carriers. I even let the carriers build up 100-150 antimatter after their squads finished.

Fighters for a strange reason have a stupid attack priority system, foe example when you jump in on an asteroid, the fighter wing many times targets the Cobalt, against which it is extremely poor. Or many times if it's a bigger planet THE GARDAS, lol, extremely poor choice, why not Krosov or LRM instead?

Kiting is very effective, and does not really need much experience to pull it off, even works against orkies but once it catches up lol..

 

Well the speed of the victim matters. Obviously you can "kite" an Orkulus much more effectively than a light frigate, which I believe has the highest speed values after scouts.

When jumping into neutral planets, my strikecraft seem to just target whatever ship is closest (when left to auto-attack), whether it's a Garda or a Krosov.

 

Can you give us TIME? How long did it take each battle to finish? My guess is the Garda one took forever. More importantly, for these tests to have any real value, you should upload the videos of them........... For this time we can only trust your word on these, even if we don't have every imporant detail.

The Flak fight did indeed take longer to kill the Akkan than any other method, but I don't particularly see the relevance. The Akkan has to retreat or take damage, it cannot trade damage efficiently; there's no point in its sticking around regardless of whether it takes 5 minutes or 15 to die. This would be relevant in a situation where it is bombing a newly colonized roid during the earlygame though, Flak would ineffective to deter it from just killing the roid and then leaving while ignoring all the frigates. But you would be unlikely to even have the Flak research, or the research for anything at all, done at such an early point in the game.


In theory flak spam may sound good, but by the time you achieve this, you are already crushed. Flak takes an extremely long time to be built, cost crystal and more credits, needs lvl2 research, and better players will just focus some LF's on them to get rid of earlier, and there goes your weaker fleet.

Competitive multiplayer is not the only form in which this game is played, although it's interesting to see how quickly the Anti-Flak Lobby is willing to assume that it is, if it can further the Anti-Flak agenda. Anyways, I already mentioned in previous discussion that Flak spam may not be effective in MP since the meta is to rush with mass LFs anyways, foregoing research, econ, or much of anything else. This doesn't mean that Flak doesn't have a role in other environments, MP games that go past early-game LF balls, SP in general, etc.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
June 13, 2014 11:44:38 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

The biggest problem I have with the flak vs Akkon test?  The Akkon isn't meant to be a heavier combat capital, not to mention that of its abilities, you selected the only non-combat one it had available.  Capital ship's power in combat come more from their abilities and (subsequently) level up rather than raw DPS (it's the same concept with Titans).  At low levels they're meant to be more easily taken without support than at higher levels.

 

That said... I have always looked at the health of the flak frigates (comparative to LF) with scepticism, as it makes no sense for the "dedicated" anti-SC ship to be tougher to crack then the frigate meant to go toe to toe with other frigates.  I guess I can see the concept from the angle of "well, it's your (truly) most viable anti-SC ship, it needs to be tough otherwise it's easy to strip a fleet of its anti-SC capabilities simply by targeting them first."  But, therein I guess, lies the fundamental problem... putting all your eggs in one basket, sort of speak.

Additionally, in many ways, the way the damage/armor/accuracy tables are set up make no sense to me.  But this is all very complex and intricately linked stuff that I have not had the time to fully go over, yet.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
June 13, 2014 12:20:08 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

The biggest problem I have with the flak vs Akkon test?  The Akkon isn't meant to be a heavier combat capital, not to mention that of its abilities, you selected the only non-combat one it had available.  Capital ship's power in combat come more from their abilities and (subsequently) level up rather than raw DPS (it's the same concept with Titans).  At low levels they're meant to be more easily taken without support than at higher levels.

The reason for Akkan's usage and ability choice is obvious, colonizer capitals are always recommended as a first ship choice. If you have to build something else for its increased combat prowess then you're sacrificing the economic benefits of an Akkan start, which is still a big negative to your overall gameplay. Even the AI prefers colonizers as its starting capital. I would only expect "combat" capitals to be present in larger, mid-game fights. Additionally, as I mentioned above, any abilities and combat attributes that make a certain capital more effective than the Akkan against Flak is also going to make it more effective against frigates in general..... so if LFs lose where Flaks win, a capital that can beat the Flaks would just beat the LFs by an even greater margin, so that Flak is still the preferred choice over that frigate type.

 

I agree about Flak HP and damage types..... I would have done things a bit differently personally, but not that much. All things considered I do think this is a shockingly well balanced game compared to many other strategy/RPG offerings which have blatantly game-breaking elements. A few thoughts about frigate balance based on what I've seen though:

1. Flak really doesn't need to be so tough. You could reduce its durability-to-fleet-supply ratio by a bit and it still wouldn't be fragile at all, but maybe no longer so durable as to out-attrition so many different things.

2. Corvettes are *too* fragile. They are just ineffective in most situations as they die too fast and therefore lose their group DPS too fast, resulting in a snowball effect where the more DPS they lose, the faster they die relative to the enemy since it is taking them exponentially longer to kill an enemy ship. I would remove some durability from Flak and give it to corvettes.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
June 13, 2014 1:09:44 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting WJC3688,
The reason for Akkan's usage and ability choice is obvious, colonizer capitals are always recommended as a first ship choice. If you have to build something else for its increased combat prowess then you're sacrificing the economic benefits of an Akkan start, which is still a big negative to your overall gameplay. Even the AI prefers colonizers as its starting capital. I would only expect "combat" capitals to be present in larger, mid-game fights.

True, but the chances that your Akkon is only going to be level 1 by the time the enemy fleet reaches you are slim to none.  For example, if one of the closer worlds to the Akkon owner's HW is a more heavily defended world (vers barely anything there like the moon or barren), you actually stand a good chance of making level 2 by the time you finish clearing out the grav well, freeing you up to pick a combat ability first.  Additionally, you also have to take build times and distance into account.  How long does it take to build a mil lab, research the flak frigate, build 12 of them, then jump them all over for the assault (vers the Akkon build time and jump)?  Again, "real-world" variables.  Maybe on a tiny or small map where the HWs are only a jump or two apart and what worlds that are available have little worth in making XP... but that won't stop the Akkon owner from purchasing a level upgrade if he has the credits and honestly feels it would help.  This kind of a scenario could also change up what type of cap ship you lead with knowing that you and your opponent are going to be butting heads very quickly.

 

Quoting WJC3688,
Additionally, as I mentioned above, any abilities and combat attributes that make a certain capital more effective than the Akkan against Flak is also going to make it more effective against frigates in general..... so if LFs lose where Flaks win, a capital that can beat the Flaks would just beat the LFs by an even greater margin, so that Flak is still the preferred choice over that frigate type.

Which I knew making all of these comments, but one of your comments was about capitals being a counter to flak (or rather, to your point, that they're not).  But, it is also why I added in the rest I did after about the flak durability.

As I've said somewhere else on this... I'm not in 100% disagreement... but based on how adamant you appear to be on this and the tossing of "Anti-flak Lobby" around at some people, I feel as though our views on it are radically different.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
June 13, 2014 1:14:07 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting WJC3688,
Even the AI prefers colonizers as its starting capital.

Do you have proof of this?

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
June 13, 2014 1:17:39 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting WJC3688,


The reason for Akkan's usage and ability choice is obvious, colonizer capitals are always recommended as a first ship choice.

In 1v1 MP/SP, but surely not as frontliner in 5s. The other colonizer caps, the Prog in particular [and the overused Egg] have more going for them in such scenarios, but I've not seen the Akkan taken by frontliners as much as say... the Mazra or the Sova. If you only end up colonizing one mood/roid in the direction of the enemy, it's actually quicker to expand in that direction with a frigate colony ship because of the longer built time that the capital has and the almost equal speeds of the frigate colonizer and caps. (I've actually tested the relative speeds of these two choices on my Quick Frontliners map at one point.) And if you bring a colonizer capital to the front line, while the enemy brings an AM-depleting battleship (Rad/Kortul) you're pretty much screwed. A lesser known fact is perhaps that colonizer capitals are slower than battleships, so there's really no running away [for long].

 

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
June 13, 2014 1:33:26 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

I agree that your capship won't necessarily be level 1, it very well could be level 2 or even 3, and those are also tests worth running. I just didn't feel like doing them at the time. I should note that the Akkan has very little in the way of meaningful combat abilities when it is by itself, Ion Bolt only disables the target ship for a few seconds and makes practically no difference whatsoever. The other 2 colonizers have stronger damage abilities and would probably fare better at level 2 or 3.

As for "real world" variables..... I do agree that it would take a bit to research and build 12 flak..... but I also doubt that you would have a situation of a capship fighting by itself with no support against a bunch of frigates in a real game anyways. It would just run away from that fight before it could take much damage. These are just some tests to establish "base" combat performance values of different ship types, more complicated runs attempting to simulate "realistic" fleets can always be done in the future.

 

As I've said somewhere else on this... I'm not in 100% disagreement... but based on how adamant you appear to be on this and the tossing of "Anti-flak Lobby" around at some people, I feel as though our views on it are radically different.

I see that these special interests have been working their mojo on you as well.... This is most unfortunate. Try to keep in mind that the ideas implanted by a certain group's propaganda don't necessarily fit with reality.

 

Do you have proof of this?

I seem to recall its being mentioned in the Artificial Unintelligence thread, but I could be remembering wrong.


Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
June 13, 2014 2:18:35 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting WJC3688,
the Cobalts only have 1 thing to shoot at,

 

Bringing up shield mitigation fast. i wonder how much different would it be to simply divide fire, so one cobalt only fires at one flak.

 

Quoting WJC3688,
If I had to venture a guess, the Akkan might have gotten mileage out of run-through micro, but not as much as say Gardas due to its incredibly slow turn rate

 

I did not really think of run-through strategies, my point was the Akkan could use more weapons if it was somewhere in the middle of flak frigates.

Quoting WJC3688,
And yet in the past you listed capital ships as a counter to Flak.

theres your answer to that:

Quoting furyofthestars,
Capital ship's power in combat come more from their abilities and (subsequently) level up rather than raw DPS (it's the same concept with Titans). At low levels they're meant to be more easily taken without support than at higher levels.

Quoting WJC3688,
A glimpse into the convenient side-switching tactics of the Anti-Flak Lobby.

Your paranoia starts to make me worry. I feel like you think I am a notorious idiot who is constantly saying flak is the weakest unit in this game and whoever builds it is a total noob. None of these are true.

Quoting WJC3688,
The Flak fight did indeed take longer to kill the Akkan than any other method, but I don't particularly see the relevance

LOL, it does have a relevance, suffering for long long minutes instead of just making another ship type a stronger component to your fleet that has focus fire abilities like LRM or LF does really make a difference.

Quoting WJC3688,
Competitive multiplayer is not the only form in which this game is played,

I know, but those strategies used there are the most effective ones. Using those strategies you can easily defeat pre-1.82 Hard AI without a single starbase ever built on a medium map.

Quoting WJC3688,
This doesn't mean that Flak doesn't have a role in other environments,

Again, you are speaking like I always say flak has no place ever in the whole game, can you wuote anything similar from my comments? There is a good strategy in MP that needs LRM's and flak as main fleet components, and if you have a titan and carrier cruisers you may have some  flak as well to weaken enemy fighters. But massing flak is not really efficient, there are much better ways to win.

Quoting furyofthestars,
That said... I have always looked at the health of the flak frigates (comparative to LF) with scepticism, as it makes no sense for the "dedicated" anti-SC ship to be tougher to crack then the frigate meant to go toe to toe with other frigates.

 

Solution could be to increase LF damage VS flak by a moderate amount. Would help in early colonisation and would make LF's a bit more useful but still not radically changing anything as LF's will still have their counters.

BUT I don't think the strength of Flak is that much of a problem. FLAK IS NOT OP, so why change anything about it?

Quoting WJC3688,
Corvettes are *too* fragile.

It was intended to be like this I think.

Quoting WJC3688,
Even the AI prefers colonizers as its starting capital

No they don't, they just randomly choose starter. I don't really see any tendency in their starter capital, and even if they have colony cap they cannot use it effectively, very often they don't even put colonizing as an ability on if for a longer time and just use colony frigates lol, so useful to build a colony cap if they always build colony frigates anyway and use them.

Quoting WJC3688,
I see that these special interests have been working their mojo on you as well.... This is most unfortunate. Try to keep in mind that the ideas implanted by a certain group's propaganda don't necessarily fit with reality.

Tell me, why would this anti-flak bullshit even exist? Has absolutely no sense, why would anyone keep the best strategy (in your thinking..) such a secret even himself never uses lol, this line of thinking has some flaws.

 

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
June 13, 2014 2:19:06 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting WJC3688,
I see that these special interests have been working their mojo on you as well.... This is most unfortunate. Try to keep in mind that the ideas implanted by a certain group's propaganda don't necessarily fit with reality.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
June 13, 2014 2:21:16 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Seleuceia,


Quoting WJC3688, reply 30Even the AI prefers colonizers as its starting capital.

Do you have proof of this?

My recollections of AIs choices in cap regards are actually the opposite. I suspect it might depend on what flavor of AI is used (Researcher/Fortifier etc.) Since all but Aggressive are too easily steamrolled in my opinion for their insufficient early fleet (especially if you play Vasari and SB-rush their HW), I only have enough data points to say with some conviction that the Aggressive ones built battleships something like 90% of the time, with the rest of 10% being carriers. I'm talking about their 1st cap here. But I think we're getting side-tracked too much here. Since the AI is hardcoded, I doubt we can get any sort of definitive proof unless someone disassembles the cap build decision routines from the exe, and that sounds like far too much trouble than it's worth for obtaining this type of info. Perhaps AI's choices of capitals should be further discussed in some other thread. 

 

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
June 13, 2014 3:01:56 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Lol turchany, did you not read my original flak post? I told you I got a ton of shit from the pro community for exposing one of their "trade secrets". They hate me so much now tha I'm pretty much banned from all their games.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
June 13, 2014 3:08:03 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Bringing up shield mitigation fast. i wonder how much different would it be to simply divide fire, so one cobalt only fires at one flak.

You do realize I was discussing Akkan vs Cobalt in that paragraph.....

Regardless, RespawnedTitan has done some in depth testing with these more "optimal" firing strategies in his thread, in case you didn't notice.

I did not really think of run-through strategies, my point was the Akkan could use more weapons if it was somewhere in the middle of flak frigates.

Again that was a statement about Akkan vs Cobalt, not Akkan vs Flak..... Given that the tests against Flak involved the gardas running back and forth on top of the Akkan, it was regularly firing multiple weapon banks against them. With some practice you might be able to find out which side of the Akkan is its "broadside" and keep the flaks away from that side indefinitely, but I didn't try to do any such thing and they still won easily.

 

Your paranoia starts to make me worry. I feel like you think I am a notorious idiot who is constantly saying flak is the weakest unit in this game and whoever builds it is a total noob. None of these are true.

I never said any such thing. Another attempt at distorting the facts by the Anti-Flak lobby. I don't know why this part is blue..... I didn't insert any formatting here......
 

Again, you are speaking like I always say flak has no place ever in the whole game, can you wuote anything similar from my comments? There is a good strategy in MP that needs LRM's and flak as main fleet components, and if you have a titan and carrier cruisers you may have some  flak as well to weaken enemy fighters. But massing flak is not really efficient, there are much better ways to win.

And you're free to provide some evidence to that claim whenever you want. You were the one who brought up the "burden of proof" after all..... where's your proof that mass flak sucks? You've only made vague and unsubstantiated statements so far.

Tell me, why would this anti-flak bullshit even exist? Has absolutely no sense, why would anyone keep the best strategy (in your thinking..) such a secret even himself never uses lol, this line of thinking has some flaws.

I spam flak in almost all my games, no idea what you're talking about. Our good citizen Stilat addressed the Anti-Flak movement quite eloquently in this topic:

http://forums.sinsofasolarempire.com/455078/page/1/#3472461

We just want these Anti-Flak apologists to finally give an honest accounting of their self-interested motives.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
June 13, 2014 5:01:06 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Stilat,
Lol turchany, did you not read my original flak post? I told you I got a ton of shit from the pro community for exposing one of their "trade secrets". They hate me so much now tha I'm pretty much banned from all their games.

 

Lol like I should take anything from you as a truth. Mr. King of the Trolls.

 

Quoting WJC3688,
You do realize I was discussing Akkan vs Cobalt in that paragraph.....

Hm, for some strange reason I misread what you wrote there. I thought this was for another test.

Quoting WJC3688,
Our good citizen Stilat addressed the Anti-Flak movement quite eloquently in this topic:

 

now I see.. I was just wasting time here with everyone else

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
June 13, 2014 5:06:55 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

SOMETIMES, I WISH HUYMAC WAS HERE TO SHARE HIS CUTENESS WITH US ALL

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 6, 2014 12:35:23 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

This is still a BIG problem... Bigger than the minidumps...

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
August 13, 2014 12:27:08 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Sinkillr,

This is still a BIG problem... Bigger than the minidumps...

 

Don't worry about Sinkillr. He's only a medium level AI and has trouble with fleet composition.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
November 9, 2014 5:41:09 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Checkmate Seleuceia.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
November 9, 2014 8:34:09 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Want to know, are you talking about flak frigates in general or the garda flak frigate in particular? seems different flak frigates have different stats?

I saw a replay once where this Aqua guy (dunno if i spelled it right) made a horde of defense vessels that kept going back and forth against a bigger group of cobalts and won the battle! i thought cobalts were meant to counter those things.

Please do explain. new to this game here.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
November 9, 2014 9:44:25 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Please do explain. new to this game here.

This is a troll thread. Most info is useless but there are bits if you are willing to wade through the garbage.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
November 9, 2014 12:34:09 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Just saw the reply again. It was someone called auqia. never even thought i could play a game like that. 0_o

Ah dang. Is there anyplace for a new person to learn the game? I have already mastered 'put starbase and and watch ai die' strategy. Went to steam but people generally are quitting games when they feel they are going to lose!

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
November 9, 2014 12:58:33 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Look for whippersnapper. He is an excellent MP player that loves to teach new ones.

Reason for Karma (Optional)
Successfully updated karma reason!
Stardock Forums v1.0.0.0    #108432  walnut2   Server Load Time: 00:00:00.0000250   Page Render Time: