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A few questions from a novice player (Rebellion).

By on November 28, 2014 5:08:14 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Bogdanov89

Join Date 08/2009
+1

I love playing on extremely large maps (usually single star) with my brother and some friends (SoaSE Rebellion).

Usually it is either 1vs1 or a 2vs2, and the matches tend to last anywhere between 2 and 4 hours with maximum population armies!

We sometimes play co-op against the AI, but the games also last a very long time on those biggest maps.

 

Since games last a very long time and the maps are colossal, i prefer going for the strongest economy right from the start.

So, with that in mind, i got a couple of questions for you experienced players:

 

At a game's start (biggest maps), what are the best ways to immediately start working on a strong economy?

Should i focus more on metal/crystal harvesting research, or should i immediately go for Trading Ports for mass Trade Ships?

Should i first go for Military Research Labs or Civilian Research Labs, if i want to setup a strong economy quickly?

How soon should i get the culture spreading buildings, if i am going for a strong economy from the start?

Is there any benefit to making multiple Trading Ports at every planet?

How often and how many Orbital Refineries should i build?

Do i need a Refinery at every planet?

In what order should i develop/upgrade/build a newly colonized planet?

Do i first make the metal/crystal extractors, or the Trade Ports/Refineries, or the various planetary upgrades?

 

With TEC i find it easy to get a strong economy quickly running, but with Advent and Vassari i am having major issues.

I focus all the money i have into economy while my small army starts conquering/colonizing surrounding planets and asteroids.

But even with all my resources going into my economy, and getting new planets that i upgrade/develop, i find myself always starved for resources as Advent and Vassari...

Also the lack of strong Trade Port upgrades and the lack of Orbital Refineries really makes my "economy focused" approach seem very weak.

Any Advent or Vassari specific economy tips, something that can help me get strong economy early on?

 

About Fighters and Bombers, in what amounts do i actually need them?

I tried multiple combinations (5 fighters 5 bombers, max bombers, max fighters...) and they all seem borderline useless?

My Fighters/Bombers attack the enemy, and i lose all of those squads very quickly.

How do i utilize strike craft vessels?

How do i make strike craft actually do something, instead of quickly dying at the start of the battle?

Are those anti-strike craft ships, like the Defense Vessel, actually useful?

 

Thank you for reading and helping out

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November 28, 2014 5:59:15 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Best thing you can do for your economy is expand as fast as possible...on large maps, always lead with a colony capital ship (akkan, progenitor, jarrasul) and try to expand in two directions: one direction with the colony cap (and a few scouts) and another direction with a normal colony ship, a few light frigates (cobalts, disciples, skirmishers) and several scouts...

The scout ships actually are highly effective at killing the krosov siege frigates around the planet (though you will need to turn autoattack on), and once those are dead you can colonize right away....first thing you should build then at the planet is a turret or 2 (maybe 3 if a planet with 2 Kodiaks) which can kill the rest of the militia and allow your small expansion fleet to move on...occasionally the planet will have a small militia (asteroid, moon, barren, and some ice/volcanics), and so instead of wasting money on a turret you can just use your light frigates to kill the militia...

Next best way to buff your economy is to build trade ports....they pay for themselves quite fast and don't require that many labs for TEC and Advent...spam them on planets best suited for industrial specialization like volcanics or on planets with lots of logistic slots like deserts and barrens...put your labs and culture on planets best suited for high population like terran, ocean, and ice...

If you know the map is roomy, build social specialization on your HW ASAP and scuttle your 2nd frigate factory (and capital ship factory after first one is built)...you can always research economic techs like meta/crystal and population, but those don't pay off as fast as trade ports and so are of secondary importance...

Basic strategy isn't much different between races when it comes to expansion...Vasari have advantage that their scouts can take neutral extractors, and the other races have better frigates...only real difference is that for Advent and Vasari you will get culture on HW first before trade, and TEC you'll go trade first...

There is no need to build any refineries....only reason you even research the tech is because it is a prerequisite to other techs...

For strikecraft, all bombers is best if you are trying to kill an SB, cap, or titan, and the enemy has no counters (corvettes and fighter spam)...otherwise, you are usually better spamming fighters....

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November 29, 2014 7:44:12 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Thank you for a great reply!

 

Of course, more answers and suggestions are always welcome

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November 30, 2014 10:01:49 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums


Should i first go for Military Research Labs or Civilian Research Labs, if i want to setup a strong economy quickly?

If you are Advent or TEC, always get at least one military lab early on for Corvettes; they are fast and good against siege frigates so they are good for clearing out neutral planets and are a powerful combo with Light Frigates early game. After I usually go for 2 civic labs for planet exploration techs, but as TEC this will also get you trade ports. Advent will need one more lab for trade.

 


How soon should i get the culture spreading buildings, if i am going for a strong economy from the start?

I wouldn't rush specifically to get them, but if you end up getting enough civic labs for them while trying to get other things and have some spare resources to invest, go and put one culture center down in a central location in your Empire. Culture doesn't contribute to your economy as much as trade but it has other bonuses.

In pure economic utility, Trade Ports > Culture > Refineries.


Is there any benefit to making multiple Trading Ports at every planet?

Sure, a planet with three tradeports makes 3 times as much credits as a planet with one trade port. Late game you will have many planets with lots of trade ports. However, even better than building a trade port at an existing planet is to build a trade port at a new planet that expands your trade chain. This will increase the trade income of all trade ports in your empire, as well as giving you the money from the new trade port.


How often and how many Orbital Refineries should i build?

Sadly if you just play the base game refineries are rarely any good. You need a centrally located planet with many phase lane connection to planets with lots of resource extractors (preferably non-colonizeable gravity wells) to make refineries work. On large maps especially, where you can get very long trade chains, trade ports are almost always better. You would not be a bad Sins player if you just always go for trade instead of refineries, since there are relatively few occasions where refineries are the better deal. It is usually more profitable and simpler to ignore them and use trade profits to buy resources on the black market (especially for TEC who can research a discount).


In what order should i develop/upgrade/build a newly colonized planet?

Get 1 (asteroids/dwarf)/2 (Everything else) population upgrades. Once you have money to invest, build logistical structures (Research, trade, culture etc). Then invest in more logistical slots, and build more logistical structures, until full.

All the other upgrades are situation. Planet Health and tactical slots are obviously only needed for planets in danger of attack. Exploration is usually a luxury for those with money to spare, but if you do get that huge economy why not.


Do i first make the metal/crystal extractors, or the Trade Ports/Refineries, or the various planetary upgrades?


Extractors! They're cheap, pay themselves off quickly, and don't use any planet slots. When first colonizing a planet the population upgrades and extractors are what you should always build right away without question.


With TEC i find it easy to get a strong economy quickly running, but with Advent and Vassari i am having major issues.


Yeah, the TEC are all about lots of simple and efficient ships. The Advent and Vasari playstyles require more finesse and rely on using powerful abilities or research well, not as much on numbers and brute force.


About Fighters and Bombers, in what amounts do i actually need them?

I tried multiple combinations (5 fighters 5 bombers, max bombers, max fighters...) and they all seem borderline useless?

My Fighters/Bombers attack the enemy, and i lose all of those squads very quickly.

How do i utilize strike craft vessels?

How do i make strike craft actually do something, instead of quickly dying at the start of the battle?

Are those anti-strike craft ships, like the Defense Vessel, actually useful?

You don't have enough fighters and bombers. Strikecraft are most deadly when you have a critical mass of dozens if not over 100 squadrons. Since strikecraft do not have collision detection (they can fly through each other), they can attack any single unit at once, while antifigter units (including other fighters) will have difficulty efficiently targeting that many units. While your strikecraft may eventually be destroyed if the enemy has lots of antifighter units or ships with abilities like Flak Burst, it is nearly impossible to protect key important capitalships, starbases or even titans from a properly executed bomber swarm.

Defense vessels aren't bad, but unfortunately they are mainly for fighters and corvettes. They do not do as well against bombers, which is what you usually fight more of late game since they can take out starbases.

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December 3, 2014 4:04:42 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Awesome!

Thank you for answering!

 

I learned a lot by reading through these super detailed replies.

More suggestions are always welcome

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