Capital Ship Choices/Strategies/Which is Worst...

from Sins Forums
So what with the new version they have implemented something I love, the choice of your starting flagship! Which has allot in common with the hero selection system of War Craft III...

So what are people choosing for their starting ships I wonder?

My choices revolve around the Akkan Battlecruiser, mostly because its good enough to get rid of starting pirates by itself, it helps your early frigate fleets against more pirates, and it can colonize on the go rapidly enough that you don't need to build a colony frigate...

My other choice is the Battlship or Carrier, each for their wonderful abillities and outright firepower, in a flagship game each is very tempting to use.

I find that the dreadnought has its uses much later in the game for rapid bombardment, but otherwise not terribly needed or wanted early on. As for the support (the dunov I think its called) choice.

Well I think its arguablly the worst, I havn't found the fighter magnet useful as it seems to affect fighters universally, thus my fighters are destroyed with its use at times... which I just plain wouldn't want. Its anti-anti-matter abillity is nice but not much different from the EMP of the Akkan, and your cobalts can do much the same with an upgrade. Finnally it has shield restore, which is useful, but the Dunov is usually the one in need of the restore! It just doesn't pack the punch!

Sure pair it with a Kol and your Kol will last longer, ... oh but wait for no more expense I could just have 2 Kols.

Anyone else feel this way? Also what are your favorite combos/fleets.

Before the patch I found myself using Kols, Cobalts, light carriers and Sova carriers.. a few repair frigates occasionally...

Now I find I actually need a few anti-fighter gunships, and I'm liking the LRMS frigate more so... though not critically.

So at any rate I'm finding more balanced fleets are more effective/neccessary than before. Though I'm still not seeing a good reason to utilize the command cruiser. I find its more effective just to have an Akkan in the back. I kind of wish we had a single Destroyer class vessel to replace this. Something about as good as the tank-like cruiser we have, but with slightly more armor, and the command abillities, suffering at the speed and turn radius of the Capital ships.

Thus it would be no better combat wise, and not worth it thus so, but useful to have 1 or two for the command abillities, as opposed to currently where it is just too weak to be worth throwing into a fight.

Or am I alone in this?

3,362 views 14 replies
Reply #1 from Sins Forums Top
There is a poll on the front page.....
Reply #2 from Sins Forums Top
Poll schmoll, we need discussions fraggit!

My first cap is always an Akkan, because of the colonise ability.

All other capships are Kol battleships. Simply because the carrier cruisers are far more usefull then Sova, because they don't take up slots.

Then there are the Dunov and the Marza... Well, I guess when you're going planet raiding, a Marza is usefull. It's missle attack is pretty strong, but that's it. The dunov is generally bad.

My ideal fleet is a line of kol, with some droid and command cruisers and a firebase of frigates, or later, cruisers.
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Reply #3 from Sins Forums Top
Poll schmoll, we need discussions fraggit!


OK, how about the thread already existing on this subject? Like, oh, here!

Though I'm still not seeing a good reason to utilize the command cruiser. I find its more effective just to have an Akkan in the back.


Personally, a squadron of 8 or so Cielo's really improves the entire assault force's chances.
Reply #4 from Sins Forums Top
yeah well aside from topic conservatism, I also mentioned strategies, such as good pairings and in particular the command cruiser, and the concepts there of.

You know more than one topic about one thing isn't bad, its when there are ten you need to start herding. I knew there was other topics, I started this one to talk about it and some other things, starting from my point of view.

in the words of somebody "chilax"

Hmmm 8 command cruisers eh, well I'll give it a shot,

also, how do people feel about early weapons techs, i rely on the cobalts early to mid so I get the lasers fully upgraded pretty quick, and focus on gunnery later, I usually go armor early, though in retrospect since the ai also uses cobalts allot, I should go shields first me thinks...
Reply #5 from Sins Forums Top

Hmmm 8 command cruisers eh, well I'll give it a shot,


Please note I tend to operate in large fleets -- smaller groups don't need as many vessels.

But support vessels like the Hoshiko / Cielo aren't something to drop in in ones or twos to your overall fleet, they need to be a major part of your force to have any real effect, same as any other unit (except capitols, they're like dozens of ships rolled into one )
Reply #6 from Sins Forums Top
i like choosing the missile one since i love using 3 or 4 of them and blowing up everything with there uber missile strick thingy lol

Kenetor
Reply #7 from Sins Forums Top
I like using a mixed force of capital ships; Sova, Akkan, and Dunov are essential; Kol less so and Marza only if I've got cash to blow (Which happens SO often) Anyways, back that mix of caps up with some fire squads of cobalts and missile frigs and it has yet to be beaten by the comp. I haven't used any of the cruisers since the update simply because I've been crashing before I teched up that much, but I'd throw some carriers and definitely some repair ships in there too. I'm sure it'll turn out differently in the Multi beta but it works for now.
Reply #8 from Sins Forums Top
Really see your the first to state the Dunov and Not the Kol

SO why is my question to you
Reply #9 from Sins Forums Top
Simple, Sovas essentially have more firepower than a kol and their more versatile. The Dunov doubles the life of any ship near it, and reduces the combat effectiveness of enemy ships near it. Meaning that instead of simply fighting an enemy with fully capable ships, I fight an enemy who has ships without abilities and without shields meaning that they are at best half as effective as my ships are, and with the akkan thrown in, its more like 2.5 times as effective as the enemy. The Dunov isn't my choice for a flagship, and it is definitely one of the last cap ships I add to my fleet, but it is essential to victory since it keeps damage from getting past my shields which are far easier and quicker to repair than hull plus shields are simply more effective at stopping damage since the shield mitigation increases throughout combat and the Dunov's shield restore ability doesn't reset the mitigation counter meaning that I wind up with a fully shielded Sova that also has a maxed out mitigation factor making it far more combat capable than anything the Enemy throws at me.
Reply #10 from Sins Forums Top
Eh, I prefer cielo's for shield regeneration improvement -- their cheaper than the Dunov. Dunov is useful, but the limited numbers of capships are, IMO, better spent on Sova's / Kols, both of which represent powers that can't be reproduced via cruisers.
Reply #11 from Sins Forums Top
The dreadnought should have the range of a missile frigate, which would give it the ability to take out turrets from a distance without entering their firing circles. That would enhance it appeal as an "assault" ship.

I don't enjoy the fact that my ship preferences are influenced by the AI target preference. If colony ships weren't such high priority targets, I wouldn't build an Akkan. It's the same with flak frigates and bombardment frigates. I don't build or engage with any of these vessels because they are the first to go, increasing the cost of reinforcing your fleets. I wish enemy carriers were more of a priority for my fleets, better yet, the player should be able to set these priorities. The ability to disembark fighters and retreat makes chasing down enemy carrier fleets tedious and unbalanced.

Then there's the problem of over-concentrated firepower. The whole fleet should not be firing on one target, unless its a large target. Because at that point, you're not adding firepower to your fleet with more ships, you're just adding more hit points.
Reply #12 from Sins Forums Top

I don't enjoy the fact that my ship preferences are influenced by the AI target preference.


Thats silly. Of course your choice of vessels is going to be influenced by how the enemy reacts to them. Thats like saying you don't like the carrier because the enemy is going to focus on killing it, so it should get more HPs.

It's the same with flak frigates and bombardment frigates. I don't build or engage with any of these vessels because they are the first to go, increasing the cost of reinforcing your fleets.


um... the bombardment frigates are something the AI should focus on. Just leave them one jump out and bring them out after you've suppressed the AI. Or, use them as a lure to make the enemy's forces come straight after you. Flak frigates I don't see the problem with -- the enemy doesn't focus on them much, if at all.

Reply #13 from Sins Forums Top
Thats silly. Of course your choice of vessels is going to be influenced by how the enemy reacts to them. Thats like saying you don't like the carrier because the enemy is going to focus on killing it, so it should get more HPs.


It's not just the enemy, but the ship AI. It's the uniformity. There's more than one way to skin a cat and the AI should pursue these other methods unpredictably. Or they should be manageable.

um... the bombardment frigates are something the AI should focus on.


There are other factors, distances, numbers, relative strength, planetary defenses, that would change your prerogatives. I hate to be so tactically minded, but these quick battlefield calculations is what interests me the most. This strategy could easily be countered with workhorse frigates possessing limited siege capabilities. I guess what I'm really saying is that ship functions are so strict that the strategy becomes black and white, and it loses its flavor.

[quote]Just leave them one jump out and bring them out after you've suppressed the AI. Or, use them as a lure to make the enemy's forces come straight after you. Flak frigates I don't see the problem with -- the enemy doesn't focus on them much, if at all.[quote]

I do this for those well developed planets. My fleets are always on hold position because the AI choses to counter attack rather than to defend its embattlements. I could see countering long range frigates. But a superior force with siege frigates in reserve? I wouldn't subject my fleet to those kind of losses just to buy a little time or be lured into it because the AI is doing it.

Anyway, because of the flak priority I chose fighter crafts over flak frigates as the preferred anti-air element in my fleet.
Reply #14 from Sins Forums Top

Anyway, because of the flak priority I chose fighter crafts over flak frigates as the preferred anti-air element in my fleet.


What flak priority? I haven't really noticed my flak frigates dropping all that much... not counting their distinct habit of running off to engage fighters on the other side of the enemies gauss cannon clusters.