Mobile jump phase inhibitors i.e. Interdictor Crusiors

http://galactic-voyage.com/Dark%20Side-Capital%20Ships-Interdictor%20Cruiser.htm
from Sins Forums

There is a lot of talk about improving the tactical side of Sins so i wanted to add a idea that would have been very useful in my last game which would add a bit more depth to sins. I was playing against two other empires on a small map so i only had 2 planets and 2 atseroids. Between my two planets was a uncolonizable asteroid belt where all my trade ships passed through. One enemy empire kept sending a fleet of 2 sovl cariers, a battlecrusior and about 15 frigates into this asteroid belt to attack my trade ships. My fleet was split defending one of my planets and one of the asteroids which was 2 jumps away from the asteroid field. My closest fleet (defending one of my planets) wasn't strong enough to defeat this fleet without being decimated istelf)and either there wasn't enough time to bring my 2nd fleet over to ensure victory or else it was too risky with the other empire breathing down my kneck! Then once i had finally got a large enough feet that could singlehandly destroy this raiding fleet the raiding fleet simply jumped back to their own world before i had destroyed more than a couple of frigates. A frigate class ship with the sole capability of inhibiting phase jump would have solved this problem and would really add some more depth to the tactics of Sins. Alternatlvely this could be added as a special ability of one of the more support orintated capital ships. Would be admirals would have to take into account the possibility that their fleets might not be able to leave a system once they enter it before launching invasions.

In my case I could have jumped my first fleet in knowing that back up was on the way!! Or would have stopped the raiding fleet fleeing when i finally got a bigger fleet together. This would create a dilema for the opposition either they accept the loss of their fleet or try to save it by jumping in reinforcements themselves to try and salvage the suitation which could lead to colossal battles!

My thinking on how this could be incoperated into the game is by only allowing 1 mobile phase jump inhibitor per empire this in itself would force tough decisions as in larger games they would be very useful all over the place but only having one means choices have to be made. More than one would just end up with it being impossible to jump into any opposition territory without encountering a mobile inhibotor. They would also have to have very strong sheilds to avoid the other fleet rushing over and just destroying it but this could be countered by it having no offensive capabilities. Even without strong sheilds the very fact that an enemy fleet would have to rush over and destroy the mobile phase inhibitor before they could flee allows your own fleet time to do some damage.

P.S for anyone familiar with Star Wars this idea is basically a Interdictor Crusior (see external link)
5,930 views 26 replies
Reply #1 from Sins Forums Top
My thinking on how this could be incoperated into the game is by only allowing 1 mobile phase jump inhibitor per empire this in itself would force tough decisions as in larger games they would be very useful all over the place but only having one means choices have to be made


No -- that is exactly the stupid design logic that I hate. "Only 1 per empire" just doesn't make sense in the context of most games. If I'm building everything on-site, why does it matter how many I build?

Use soft caps. ALWAYS use soft caps. Make it so that it isn't economically wise to spam those things.
hey would also have to have very strong sheilds to avoid the other fleet rushing over and just destroying it but this could be countered by it having no offensive capabilities.


Correct me if I'm wrong, but you already gave it an offensive capability: countering phase-jumps.
Reply #2 from Sins Forums Top
You won't get it.

The old inhibitors were changed because they made "deathtraps". (Even though you could scout, thus making those traps traps no more.)

You're jump inhibitor ship would be even worse, making a possible deathtrap in every area. (Even though you limit it to one only, it's enough since it would make fleeing impossible from the enemy.) Giving it strong shields would make it even more imba, since you would then get a sure kill at weaker fleets.

Siege of Centauri
Reply #3 from Sins Forums Top
BTW, what would be nice would be a ship that temporarily blocks phase travel... for individual ships. Or, better yet, just increases the "charge-up" time for all enemy units (or just the one...)

Don't you just HATE it when the enemy goes to all the trouble of jumping out with his capitolship?
Reply #4 from Sins Forums Top
Vasari are the masters of phase technology, so if there's anything like this in the game, I'd expect they're the ones that have it. Don't bet on it for TEC.
Reply #5 from Sins Forums Top
BTW, what would be nice would be a ship that temporarily blocks phase travel... for individual ships


Ion Bolt does that me thinks...
Reply #6 from Sins Forums Top
Vasari are the masters of phase technology, so if there's anything like this in the game, I'd expect they're the ones that have it. Don't bet on it for TEC.



Hehe...is that a hint?

I like the idea in theory, but I think if it exists it should be something that the fleet that uses it will have to put significant resources to defend it.
I'm thinking something frigate or cruiser sized, slow moving, with weaker then average shielding and armor. You know how weak a colony frigate is compared to the other frigates..well an phase inhibition cruiser should be similarly as weak when compared to other cruisers, i.e. somewhere between frigates and cruisers in armor/shields.
Also, the interdiction shouldn't be passive ability, but an anti-matter consuming ability that lasts maybe 10-20 seconds so you couldn't just use it all the time and would have to wait for anti-matter to build up again to use it.
Reply #7 from Sins Forums Top
Hehe...is that a hint?


Not at all. I have no idea if the Vasari have anything like that or not, just that they'd be the ones to do it if anyone
Reply #8 from Sins Forums Top
I reckon its going to be a Vasari special ability on one of its cap ships - maybe the Lv6 ability . It be good to be deathtrap and offcourse it takes up antimatter and has a long cooldown so its not going to be overpowered and eventually the enemy will be able to leave the area or kill that cap first. It be a really good tactical ploy.
Reply #9 from Sins Forums Top
The old inhibitors were changed because they made "deathtraps". (Even though you could scout, thus making those traps traps no more.)



Honk if you want the old inhibitors back!
Reply #10 from Sins Forums Top
Oh well; HONK


If the Vasari get such a device I feel it should be capital ship size to prevent a very large slow and obvious target. It should not have significant hit points or shields either... as a result of phasic radiation interference from the device itself (haha)

I would have it completely disallow phase jumps, but take up about 30 Crew... if a cap ship had this as an abillity, well that would be neat but deadly.
Reply #11 from Sins Forums Top


Ion Bolt does that me thinks...


Let me rephrase: a spammable, not capship unit, with the power. Something I'd actually bother to build, unlike an Akkan in most games (larger maps yes, smaller maps I need other types of ships).
Reply #12 from Sins Forums Top
The devs could also add a range to the ship's Inhibitor so it needs to be in the thick of things to prevent enemies from fleeing.

An anti matter cost/duration would also be a way of limiting it.

As for the Vasari, I believe I read about one of their ships already having this ability...although that was a while back.
Reply #13 from Sins Forums Top
If not inhibitor, what about delayer?
Adding like 5 seconds to the jump buildup would give your fleet some time to pummel or close in on the fleeing enemy.
You would have the possibility to catch up a little

The is alreay a research that decreases jump time, why not make a ship that can increase it for the enemy if activating one of its abilities?
Reply #14 from Sins Forums Top
If not inhibitor, what about delayer?


Right now, anything would be more useful than the current "phase jump inhibitors".
I have suggested before that an alternative (actually useful) phase inhibitor might slow down phase lane traffic. this could be cumulative (e.g. -25% speed/ inhibitor) and would give you more time to rally a defensive fleet.

Or, they could just give us the old inhibitors back.
Reply #15 from Sins Forums Top
well, slower phase travel would be cool for incoming flets, but for outgoing (if they flee from you) you have to delay the jump build up time
Reply #16 from Sins Forums Top
I still say have the PJI use antimatter to prevent jumps, say it uses 100 units to stop all phase jump out of a system for one min or so.. This could be auto cast or manual ..
Reply #17 from Sins Forums Top
I still like the old inhibitors, to leave that gravity well, you HAD to destroy it...

It made scouts mid-late game even more useful, as they have that option to ignore phase inhibitors once researched.
Reply #18 from Sins Forums Top
a cruiser inhibitor should only be effective for a short time period.

and we do have a really small cruiser inhibitor now. although it only works on one ship at a time.
Reply #19 from Sins Forums Top

and we do have a really small cruiser inhibitor now. although it only works on one ship at a time.


?
Reply #20 from Sins Forums Top
the akken can stop a ship from phase jumping

sorry didn't mean cruiser meant cap ship.
Reply #21 from Sins Forums Top
Right now, anything would be more useful than the current "phase jump inhibitors".


The current ones are useful enough, it's just that most people don't bother skipping planets to get to a juicier target, AI especially.

It's ironic how most people are so anti-turtling but want the old inhibitors back. What do you think preventing all phase jumping helps? Turtling! Sure, you can spot a trap with a scout. But what if that planet is the only entry into that player's space, and he has it built up fully with stationary defenses and his whole fleet there? Now what are you going to do? Can't avoid a death trap, the only thing you can do is bash your head on it and keep losing fleets hoping to break through..

So no, no old style inhibitors.
Reply #22 from Sins Forums Top
The current ones are useful enough


i have never again built one after they were changed. what a waste of supply points! I just build another hangar or some turrets or a repair center. at the very least, the supply point cost of the current pji should be reduced to 1.

It's ironic how most people are so anti-turtling but want the old inhibitors back.


I never said I was anti-turtling. in fact, i am a confessing turtle! i love turtling!
However, they old pji's were also good for an offensive strat because they could create fallback points.

Also, I strongly disagree with the notion that an offensvie strat should be the only viable strat in the game!

. But what if that planet is the only entry into that player's space, and he has it built up fully with stationary defenses and his whole fleet there?


then he was smart and shouldn't be punished for knowing how to use choke points!

also, most (all?) maps are designed so there are several lanes connected to territories. and stars can't be fortified for a reason.

Now what are you going to do?

destroy the pji or build a fleet of scouts for raiding?


Let's face it, the current pji's are just useless.
Reply #23 from Sins Forums Top

The current ones are useful enough, it's just that most people don't bother skipping planets to get to a juicier target, AI especially.


It's quite useful in multi player.

And yes, after some playing I have to say: I like the current behavior.
Reply #24 from Sins Forums Top
It's quite useful in multi player.


That's what I was trying to point out Against the AI the current one is useless because the AI never tries to skip through grav wells. Humans surely can, though I've yet to see one try

i have never again built one after they were changed. what a waste of supply points! I just build another hangar or some turrets or a repair center. at the very least, the supply point cost of the current pji should be reduced to 1.


Just because you haven't built one doesn't automatically make them useless. Useless for your playstyle perhaps, but not useless in general.

I never said I was anti-turtling. in fact, i am a confessing turtle! i love turtling!
However, they old pji's were also good for an offensive strat because they could create fallback points.

Also, I strongly disagree with the notion that an offensvie strat should be the only viable strat in the game!


The statement about irony wasn't referring to you specifically, but every time inhibitors come up somewhere plenty of people always post about the joys of the old ones. Well, the old ones were before Multiplayer. Sure it must've been nice to set a death trap for an AI and blow his fleet to bits. Not so fun when you're getting blown up in MP, though.

then he was smart and shouldn't be punished for knowing how to use choke points!

also, most (all?) maps are designed so there are several lanes connected to territories. and stars can't be fortified for a reason.


And in most maps it's fairly easy to limit the number of entries to your space down to 2-3 planets. My example with one was extreme, but possible if you're allied, for example. Choke points are important enough as it is.

destroy the pji or build a fleet of scouts for raiding?


Yep, you can sacrifice the bulk of your fleet to take out that inhibitor, then the rest trying to make it to the edge of the grav well to escape because you can't break his other defenses. So the turtler loses the inhibitor, maybe a few ships few static defenses, you lose most/all of your fleet (including capital ships) plus the time it takes you to rebuild it and jump to the planet again And a fleet of scouts would be.. marvelously useless for any sensibly fortified area, they just don't have the firepower. Plus you can't bombard planets with scouts, making any of your incursions pointless in the end, since the number of scouts you'd need to pull it off would cost more than the damage you would inflict with them
Reply #25 from Sins Forums Top
every time inhibitors come up somewhere plenty of people always post about the joys of the old ones


maybe because they were good the way they were! If there still are plenty of supporters left, that should give everybody some thought. I am not even saying we "must" return to the old way, all i am saying is that the current pji's are not worth building.

but then, i am against that whole safe-jump-into-hostile-systems mechanic, with the limited turret range just asking for system hopping. The temptation to run somebody's defenses wouldn't even exist if the turrets reached everywhere, as they should.



Not so fun when you're getting blown up in MP, though.


though it has been said a thousand times before: that is what scouts are for.


Also, i hate the steamroll-of-death mechanic that the game currently amounts to. Why even build defenses? just build a blob of death and wipe everybody out.



Yep, you can sacrifice the bulk of your fleet to take out that inhibitor, then the rest trying to make it to the edge of the grav well to escape because you can't break his other defenses.


dunno... i just don't think defenses are that powerful. Which means they really need no nerfing, as was the case for the pji.