Average Game Length?

from Sins Forums
Hi Guys,

I was curious about the average length of a game of Sins. They make a big deal that you can play on a Giant map that will take a really long time to resolve, or play a tiny map and finish in 20 or 30 minutes.

I believe that you can do this, but I find it hard to believe that the game will play equally well at both extremes. I see how the ginormous game could be fun, with battles of an epic scale and such. But do the tech trees scale this large? Do you just wind up sapmming the uber units at the end? Or does it feel like your just playing in slow motion?

And what about the small scale?


How exactly does the 20 minute match work? In most RTSes when you play on teeny maps, the game winds up being really brief and really tight, but always feels like it ends before it began. You never reach any significant tech level, and wind up losing due to some minor mistake.

What is the shortest match/smallest map you can play and feel like you got the full (or at least most of) the Sins experience? What is the average lenght of most online games?

Just curious.

19,347 views 7 replies
Reply #1 from Sins Forums Top
Wow there's a lot in that post, let me talk about it a bit, I guess :P

Firstly, the tech trees don't "scale" in the sense you're probably talking about. Some of the smallest maps can take as little as 30-40 minutes (below that is pushing it) due to the mechanics of the game. In most RTS games, structures are very quick to destroy. In Sins, planet bombardment takes a while, especially on small maps where you can't get as many ships. Still, small map games can last a long enough time to tech up the tree fairly considerably, if you're willing to invest the resources into it. The biggest slow-down is that your economy is largely based on how many planets you control, so obviously on small maps you can't have as expansive of an economy as on large maps.

The time it takes to complete larger games scales up very quickly because you're not just adding a little bit of building room like in traditional RTS games, you're adding solar systems and planets, and doubling the number of planets on the map has a much more pronounced effect on the time it takes to complete than doubling a standard RTS map size.

I guess it's a bit hard to describe when you didn't play the game, but does this help at all?
Reply #2 from Sins Forums Top
How exactly does the 20 minute match work?
End of quote


In general, it doesn't. On the very smallest maps, sometimes someone will pull of a rush, but thats about it.
Groupy 2 - Organize multiple applications into grouped tabs on your Windows desktop
Reply #3 from Sins Forums Top
k, thirty/fourty five minutes matches. Whatever.

I'm just curious how games on the smallest maps turn out. Do you feel like you actually played game of Sins of a Solar Empire? Or do you feel like you've played a game of MiniSins.

It sounds like on smaller maps with limited resources, you might only get to see a fraction of what the game is capable of.

How big is an average map? (i.e. the ones most played) And how long do most games last? I guess that's my question.

About tech tree scaling, i guess what I meant is in a large map, will i still only get the largest units towards the end of the game? Or will the game end with me spamming these largest units?


Helpful post Annatar, thanks. :)
Reply #4 from Sins Forums Top

About tech tree scaling, i guess what I meant is in a large map, will i still only get the largest units towards the end of the game? Or will the game end with me spamming these largest units?
End of quote


Actually, you get the biggest units from the beginnings of the game :D You don't get some of the cruisers until later in the tech tree, but I don't think that answers your question. Your question is actually kind of a bad question, as your used to thinking in terms of normal RTS's, where later units are better than earlier units. In Sins, later units add to earlier units, rather than supplanting them. (Note: The one exception is that Kodiaks (and Vasari Analog) replace Cobalts (and the Vasari Analog) for almost all purposes...)
Reply #5 from Sins Forums Top
It sounds like on smaller maps with limited resources, you might only get to see a fraction of what the game is capable of.
End of quote


This is fairly close. It depends on the players, though. The smallest map is 9 planets, with the rival players only 3 jumps apart. So that one really doesn't have room for much and ends fast. Some "small" maps can have 15ish planets I think (I confess, it's been a while since I looked), and those take longer and let you experience more of the game without ending prematurely.

How big is an average map? (i.e. the ones most played) And how long do most games last? I guess that's my question.
End of quote


It depends on the number of players, really. Most games I'm used to playing have been medium maps with ~30 or so planets for 4-6 people. Those games also depend on how people play. I've had some that ended in 2-2.5 hours, some that dragged on for 4.

About tech tree scaling, i guess what I meant is in a large map, will i still only get the largest units towards the end of the game? Or will the game end with me spamming these largest units?
End of quote


Sins is unique in that the largest unit is not necessarily the one you want to build. It relies a lot of having a bit of everything (some things can be passed by, but in general a fleet composed of only 1-2 types of ships, excluding capitals, will not do well). So in that sense, it takes a while to research all the ship hulls, but even after you do you still do find yourself building the ones lower on the tech tree.

As far as the time it takes, if you're very diligent and research focused, you can probably knock out one of the two tech trees in 2.5-3 hours (research is split into civic and military). If you really don't need to build a lot of ships and can dedicate tons of resources to it, you can probably do it sooner. The large games last a lot longer than that, so you'll be playing the majority of the larger maps fully teched up.
Reply #6 from Sins Forums Top
I read somewhere that a some games (with 100 planets) can take upwards to a week.
Reply #7 from Sins Forums Top
It would probably last alot longer, much much longer; but it wouldn't take a week in most cases.

Realistically, the players with the most patience will be the winners in those maps; along with the most freetime.
Technically, this game can last forever since there are no fully deletable resources.