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Water-boarding, Simple yes or no!

February 12, 2008 5:15:51 PM from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums

For those of you that think water-boarding is TORTURE, and I have seen many of you say it is torture and under NO CIRCUMSTANCES should it be used. I propose the following question.

 

YOUR son, daughter, husband, wife, mother, father, you pick which one! has been kidnapped and one of the kidnappers has been caught and is refusing to talk. Would water-boarding be ok to you then?

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ParaTed2k
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Reply #1 February 12, 2008 6:01:50 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
That's not a "yes" or "no" question... at least not in the context of waterboarding detainees. Kidnapping is a crime, not an act of war against the United States.

Criminals are afforded Constitutional Rights. The U.S. Constitution was never meant to be extended to enemies during war. If it was, we wouldn't even be able to drop a bomb or artillery round unless the people in the blast zone were actively shooting at the time.
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Reply #2 February 12, 2008 8:12:12 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
Would water-boarding be ok to you then?


No and I can't imagine answering yes to any hypothetic situation proposed. But then, I think you already knew I'd say no.
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Reply #3 February 12, 2008 8:15:32 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums

Reply By: ParaTed2kPosted: Tuesday, February 12, 2008
That's not a "yes" or "no" question... at least not in the context of waterboarding detainees. Kidnapping is a crime, not an act of war against the United States.

Criminals are afforded Constitutional Rights. The U.S. Constitution was never meant to be extended to enemies during war. If it was, we wouldn't even be able to drop a bomb or artillery round unless the people in the blast zone were actively shooting at the time.

Nice dodge of the question.

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Reply #4 February 12, 2008 8:16:13 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums

Reply By: dynamasoPosted: Tuesday, February 12, 2008
Would water-boarding be ok to you then?


No and I can't imagine answering yes to any hypothetic situation proposed. But then, I think you already knew I'd say no.

So before you would let a criminal get water boarded you would let a loved one die.

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Reply #5 February 12, 2008 8:21:38 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
To directly answer your question:

YOUR son, daughter, husband, wife, mother, father, you pick which one! has been kidnapped and one of the kidnappers has been caught and is refusing to talk. Would water-boarding be ok to you then?


No.

I would use a pair of pliars and a blowtorch.
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Reply #6 February 12, 2008 8:22:05 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
Water boarding takes too long, I'd go straight to testicular electrocution. No one fucks with my friends or family, period.

However, I don't think torture techniques should be incorporated into organizations...i.e police and military. Though perhaps worst case scenario it could be used. I don't like the idea of torture, and I'm not a fan of it becoming day to day procedure. Only in urgent cases would I support it...and I'm talking blowing shit up urgent.

~Zoo
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Reply #7 February 12, 2008 8:22:34 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
Nice dodge of the question.


It's like I told a lawyer once... "You get to ask me questions, but you don't get to tell me how to answer." ;~D
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InfoGeek
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Reply #8 February 12, 2008 8:25:04 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
So before you would let a criminal get water boarded you would let a loved one die.

nōn sequitur..

Your situation does not imply death...

Also, the guilt of the kidnapper is confirmed and the danger is reat.

The involvement in the tortured "enemy combatant in the anticipated attack is not.

IG
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Reply #9 February 12, 2008 11:30:39 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
No. Torture is never "okay". Even if they've kidnapped your family member, that doesn't give you the right to torture them, especially if that torture can lead to permanent brain damage and death. That the position of "okay torture" is even agreed with (or modulated to some more severe action) shows a severe lack of regard for the sanctity of human life.
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Dr Guy
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Reply #10 February 13, 2008 10:04:21 AM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums

So before you would let a criminal get water boarded you would let a loved one die.

Mike Dukakis would.

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Reply #11 February 13, 2008 11:05:47 AM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
(Citizen)little-whipFebruary 13, 2008 07:53:17Reply #10


I do believe after being accussed o0f a crime by you {not paying taxes} then being told to go "fuck yourself Elie" not once but several times, it would be best if we just stayed away from each other Sabrina.

Peace.
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Reply #12 February 13, 2008 11:08:02 AM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
Yes if Someone Kidnapped Colleen or one of my kids or my brother or grandkids, there is nothing I would not do to the kidnapper to get my love ones back. But most of you already knew this.
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Reply #13 February 13, 2008 11:10:10 AM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
Death_By_Beebles


No. Torture is never "okay". Even if they've kidnapped your family member, that doesn't give you the right to torture them, especially if that torture can lead to permanent brain damage and death. That the position of "okay torture" is even agreed with (or modulated to some more severe action) shows a severe lack of regard for the sanctity of human life.


no offense, and I mean that, but what color are the trees on your world? from MY FRAME OF REALITY, what you said is total crap. no offense.
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Reply #14 February 13, 2008 11:34:32 AM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
InfoGeekFebruary 12, 2008 20:25:04Reply #8


So before you would let a criminal get water boarded you would let a loved one die.

nōn sequitur..

Your situation does not imply death...

Also, the guilt of the kidnapper is confirmed and the danger is reat.

The involvement in the tortured "enemy combatant in the anticipated attack is not


since most states treat kidnapping as a capitol offense and the captured kidnapper can identify his partners, a deal would be struck to keep the caught one alive and in prison for a minimial term, the chances of recovering a person kidnapped are around one in 10 {alive} stats from the FBI} you do the math and then figure how much do you want your loved one back.
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Reply #15 February 13, 2008 12:13:44 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
(Citizen)little-whipFebruary 13, 2008 12:05:06Reply #16


Sabrina, I would never delete your comments, first.

second, would have been kind of hard for me to ask for anything back then, remember I was in a coma. Although I greatly appreciate what you did for Colleen.

Third, My e-mail address is still the same, ask meg as she recently emailed me.

If there has been some kind of confusion about me saying "just ask" I am sorry kiddo, but at the time I was thought I was being a friend by saying that.

Not many people in my life when I was down were willing to give ME a blank check.
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Reply #16 February 13, 2008 8:00:09 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
So before you would let a criminal get water boarded you would let a loved one die.


You asked a question, I gave you an answer. I didn't know you were loading this question so you could take potshots at the answers you don't like.

I could never, in all good consciousness, let anyone be tortured, regardless of what they might have done. My loved ones know this about me, which is one of the reasons they love me. I would be hypocritical to my own personal philosophys to act any other way.
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Reply #17 February 13, 2008 8:05:57 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
That the position of "okay torture" is even agreed with (or modulated to some more severe action) shows a severe lack of regard for the sanctity of human life.


First of all, welcome back to JU, Beebs.

Second of all...you have a point with "okay torture." It's never "okay" and never will be. However, if someone fucks with my friends or family and I had a hostage, I'd use any means necessary to make him spill the beans. I may be disgusted, he may be fucked, and I may regret it later...but to save someone I would go to that extreme.

~Zoo
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Reply #18 February 13, 2008 8:45:36 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
If there's any certainty in this world, it's that one always has more relatives. I'd say no to using waterboarding. Considering how effective most police services are bringing a halt to kidnappers, I'd be happy to leave it all up to them.
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Reply #19 February 13, 2008 8:57:26 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
My answer is no. Wrong is wrong and illegal is illegal.

I think another way to look at this is - one of our service members is being held prisoner. Is it okay for whoever is holding the soldier prisoner to waterboard the soldier?
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Reply #20 February 14, 2008 1:14:43 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums

Reply By: dynamasoPosted: Wednesday, February 13, 2008
So before you would let a criminal get water boarded you would let a loved one die.


You asked a question, I gave you an answer. I didn't know you were loading this question so you could take potshots at the answers you don't like.

I could never, in all good consciousness, let anyone be tortured, regardless of what they might have done. My loved ones know this about me, which is one of the reasons they love me. I would be hypocritical to my own personal philosophys to act any other way.

I would never take a shot at you maso. I am glad you stand by your principles no matter what, I don't understand it. but I do respect it.

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Reply #21 February 14, 2008 1:16:23 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums

Reply By: Zoologist03Posted: Wednesday, February 13, 2008
That the position of "okay torture" is even agreed with (or modulated to some more severe action) shows a severe lack of regard for the sanctity of human life.


First of all, welcome back to JU, Beebs.

Second of all...you have a point with "okay torture." It's never "okay" and never will be. However, if someone fucks with my friends or family and I had a hostage, I'd use any means necessary to make him spill the beans. I may be disgusted, he may be fucked, and I may regret it later...but to save someone I would go to that extreme.

That's my point too. It's never ok to torture someone, {if waterboarding is torture, the jury is still out on this one} But would I do it? heck yes!

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Reply #22 February 14, 2008 1:17:42 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums

Reply By: LocamamaPosted: Wednesday, February 13, 2008
My answer is no. Wrong is wrong and illegal is illegal.

I think another way to look at this is - one of our service members is being held prisoner. Is it okay for whoever is holding the soldier prisoner to waterboard the soldier?

Maybe you should start reading what exactly they do to our men when they capture them before making a statement like that.

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Reply #23 February 14, 2008 1:18:27 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums

Reply By: cactoblastaPosted: Wednesday, February 13, 2008
If there's any certainty in this world, it's that one always has more relatives. I'd say no to using waterboarding. Considering how effective most police services are bringing a halt to kidnappers, I'd be happy to leave it all up to them.

sure you can always get another mother cacto.

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Reply #24 February 14, 2008 2:01:36 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
Maybe you should start reading what exactly they do to our men when they capture them before making a statement like that.


I know that much worse things have been done to our soldiers but I think we have to take the high road. I don't think we can condemn other's torture if we are doing the same.
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Reply #25 February 14, 2008 2:48:25 PM
from JoeUser ForumsJoeUser Forums
(Citizen)little-whipFebruary 14, 2008 13:43:2


Elie, my emails still get bounced back. If we've misunderstood each other we need to straighten things out.

Would you please drop me a line at Pearlcaster ( at hot male dot etc. ) And be sure to add that addy as one that's 'acceptable' on your end?


done.
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