I second all of that.

One change I'd dearly love to see is the ability to load more than one mod at the same time.

If I want to play multiple mods currently it's just not possible unless I personally go through and merge them both togther into a single mod.

Part of the way to prevent file erros when two different mods both change the same files is to have which ever mod is loaded first take priority on files. (example, you want to load two mods, one that improves the power of captial ships, and a another one that makes captial ships cheaper and also improves frigates. IF you load the captial ship improvement mod first then the changes from that mod will overwrite any changes to the cap ship files the second mod would try to make to captial ships. Now that I reread that it's a little muddled but does it make sense?)

In general though it would be helpful when you just want to add a few mods together that do completely different things, such as sins plus, which only effects planatery types, bonuses etc, and something like mars effect, which changes the ships and battles...)

Do you have any idea how badly this would break an average mod? You can't just start willy-nilly shutting out data files in case of a checksum difference, you'll end up with crashes.

In short, no I don't have any idea how badly it would break an average mod, hence the reason why I listed it as a suggestion.

It woudl howe3ver work for mods that alter different files. (and a simple check sum comparison to make sure two of the same file isn't present in both mods would prevent the crashes you're talking about.

To Uzii's and Silveressa's comments:
I second that as well. We need the ability to add more research fields and take advantage of those empty slots, and the ability to load multiple mods at once, with a top to bottom priority.

Here's some other ideas that I would like to see, that may or may not already be in development:

The full mod tools...enough said. An actual outside program that is capable of FULLY modding the game, not just files
A Particle editor, so we can change effects.

In Galactic Civ 2, there was an in game ship editor that was awesome. Is there some way to make this for SINS? Then, we wouldn't have to mess with all that XSI, and 3D modeling programs that you need a PHD to use.

Moons...that would be nice. To be able to put in more than one celestrial body inside a gravity well, like moons or double stars.

The ability to add races, planets, stars, etc, without the game crashing.

That's it for now.

DANMAN

Thanks guys, we've taken notes on everything posted. Here is what we have for 1.04:

-New Reference Data

-New Convert Data

-List of Changed Files

You can grab the 1.04 reference data, a new convert data a list of all the changed files here: https://stardock.cachefly.net/SinsModPackage1.04.zip. You probably won't be able to use these files correctly without the associated exe but it will allow you to get going on your conversions.

-Entity name lookup is now case insensitve.

-I can't release the symbol file for security reasons but there are new options to enable error messages. This can be turned on by modders in the user.setting file to simplify tracking down errors instead of mysteriously crashing. (i.e You can use ShowErrors TRUE to get more info).

-For those of you who may have missed it, instructions on XSI and how to get Sins meshes in the game from scratch are included in the Modding Documentation here: https://www.sinsofasolarempire.com/Modding_Documentation.zip

-You should never have to convertdata every file by hand. We use python scripts to automate things like this (very easy) and the batch control method (a bit more cryptic) listed earlier in this thread is good as well depending on what you are doing.

Judging by the posts here, perhaps one of the best things I can do is explain how mod development should operate. You need to setup an environment and toolset very similiar to game development.

First, you need scripts to automate stuff (i.e ConvertData). I recommend Python and there are plenty of beginner examples out there that run through a bunch of directories/files and applies a program to them.

You need comparison tools. Once you look at my zip file look at the report of files. I use a program that compares the entire Sins 1.04 directory with the Sins 1.03 directory. I turn on full binary comparison and turn off time stamps (there are lots of other options). Then I tweak a bunch of easy filters to give me just the files that differ or are/aren't included across the two versions. I can also easily click each of those files to see the exact differences and it gives me the option to manually or automaticaly merge them among a variety of other tricks. I then spit out a report of the differences for you guys. This is how you should be upgrading mods. As a test, I pretended to update my "modded" files to the 1.04 format and using this method it took about 5 minutes. Depending on the size of your mod I really can't see it taking more than 20-30 minutes. The program I use and I very strongly recommend it is called "Beyond Compare". Its free for 30 days (and very reasonably priced for its power) so give it a shot. I've been looking around and I can't find one that is more suited to game development. We will be ordering copies for the whole company soon given how much the demo has improved my workflow (we previously used a weaker, free program that I won't rag on but it wasn't as nearly as good).

Finally, anyone working in modding or software development needs to use some form of source control. It would take me a very long time to list all the advantages but the basic idea is you have a program that stores versions of completed files. You then request from the program to modify a file and when you are done you submit it back to the program who tracks the entire history/evolution of the file(s). At any point you can do a "difference" between an earlier version and the one you are working on so you can see what you changed or you can revert back to an early non-bugged version etc. There are plenty of free source control programs out there including CVS and Subversion.  

Edit: Oh and source control makes it much easier for multiple people to work on the project

Well that's just a quick overview. I may write up a more detailed basic mod development tutorial using free tools if that is something you guys feel you would actually try out. I can see from the various comments in this thread and all over the modding section that most people would benefit a fair bit. The basics of proper development aren't too difficult but they yield so much.

P.S Since there seems to be a lot of interest in merging mods: the things I'm talking about should make this sort of thing relatively painless.

 

Thanks!

Though i haven't worked on modding yet since it's too limited right now.

Blair,
Thank you very much for that great info, it will help out big time since I am one of those "mergers".
It is fantastic that you are providing us with the update info before the patch comes out so that we can get moving. I know that I and the other modders will appreciate it.
By the way, speaking of XSI and meshes, have you guys decided on the matter of releasing the original ship models to us in XSI format?
If you did, I'm sure the modding community will make it worth your effort.

Thanks again for all those tips, especially about the comparing tools and management programs. Looking forward to hearing from you again.

DANMAN

This is very impressive.. best mod supporting dev I ever met.   Still I`m completly know nothng about programing so making script for convertdata is big mountain for me  

Thanks much, Blair! Definitely some good tips. We do actually use CVS for our ST mod to keep everything together and organized, just need to figure out how to use it personally

If you do have time, though, I for one would definitely appreciate a basic tutorial - anything to improve efficiency would be fantastic

Blair I seriously want to cry right now. You are so awesome.

a HUGE thanks for your tips, and of course for the 1.04 ref files.

Many words can some up my feelings now, but the best to describe it would be:
F***ING SWEET!

Everything you said above was like some drug-induced dream. The more I read, the better it got. I still can't believe how much you took note of our requests, unlike 95% of developers out there who ask, and never respond. I'll definitely check out 'Beyond Compare', and would greatly appreciate any tutorial on the more complex ways to merge/script/compare/update/etc...

This is a great way to kick start S+ 1.4, as I could feel myself slowly slipping away from it, and back into FPS kill-kill-kill action.

You sir, are a Godsend to the modders here, and to your studio/company/team. Thank you.

Excellent feedback Blair

I have to admit i was a little worried we might all be whistling into the wind about what we wanted to see and it'd be for the most part ignored.

I happy to see I was gravely mistaken; the support for this game is absolutely top notch.

Blair, thanks for the files and info. This will certainly make things much easier, translating into better mods. A virtual pint for you!

I think we are all clapping our hands.
If there is anyway to give us more, please do so. We are very excited about this.

DANMAN