Usefulness of some TEC ships

1. I don't know about the Percheron, but the Hachiko repairs ships pretty fast and the Cielo gives nearby units increased shield regeneration and with an upgrade, can increase the damage a target takes by 25%.

2. It depends on the map size (how much distance between your home planet and the enemy's). On small maps, the Kol/Marza is the best choice because you want to kill your neighbor's capship fast. However on large maps, you can expand much faster with a colonizer capship due to it's bigger antimatter pool and regeneration.

This is a hotly debated topic. Someone ( forgot who ) actually ran a demo, using a colonizer cap, versus a battleship and a frigate. Turns out a frigate takes a little longer, since it's anti-matter recharge rate is much less then the Akkan so the frigate waits to colonize. Points against the battleship/frigate choice also include limited resources at the beginning of the game going to construct the frigate. Points for the battleship/frigate combo are a better cap ship later in the game and the ability to split the cap ship for assults and the frigate ( with other ships ) to clean up asteroids behnind your front lines.

I still am not sure which is fastest or more effective, but depending on the game will now consider a colonizer as my first cap ship. Against an AI, If my scouts ( first two ships I will ALWAYS build ) report I am surrounded by weak planets/asteroids, I build a colonizer for fast expansion. If surrounded by heavily defended planets ( Desert, terran or bad luck ), I build a Kol/Marza since I won't be doind any 'quick' expansion anyway. Against a human ( who might rush ) a Kol or Marza might mean some insurance at the expense of (possibly ) faster expansion. Either way you could get hosed.

1.

I would like to point out that the Hoshiko Cruiser, act much like a mobile repair platform, and has the same short coming as they do. The short coming is that under focus fire, a 300 hitpoint repair(I think that it is bigger then a repair plantform, but still has the same short comings) is gone as fast as the rate of repair. I have noted, that there are times, the when the hoshiko can repair fast enought to same a capital ship, but can't save a lower class ship. I think this is do to the difference in armor between a capital ship, and a lower class of ship.

In order to make the Hoshiko and for that matter, the Cielo usefull, you must use them together. The Hoshiko can repair the hull, while the Cielo help to recahrge the sheilds. One of the changes that people posted about, was that the Hoshiko repair, need to also have a shield restore, as focuse fire, would remove the hitpoint as fast(or faster) then they could be repaired. I still don't under stand why people did not note that the shiled restore that was badly need, was on the Cielo.

Remeber, that even thougth, all sides, have defensive and offensive ships, they still work differently form one the other. While the Advent and Vasari turly have defensive and offensive ship, the defenseive and offensive abilities of the TEC ships, are split between the Hoshiko cruiser and the Cielo cruiser. In other words, the Hoshiko has both a defensive abilitie and an offensive abilitie, just like the Cielo has an offensive and defensive abilitie.

The Percheron in my mind, is about the same, as any other carrier cruiser. Its use is up to you.

2. The problem you ask about for this one, comes down to the old, Battleship vs. colony capital ship debate. There are post on this for battleship, for colony capital ship, and for other ship. I can't really help you there, with out more information.

I've done it both ways and since I play the Advent now I always build the colonizer first. When I played as the TEC I HATED the Akkan so I always went Sova or Kol first. You do have to like the capital ship you get, because chances are it will be your highest leveled ship at the end.

The Cielo is useful in small numbers (between 6 and 12) and Designate Target is handy for knocking out the other guy's capital ships. When you first get Hoshikos, you don't need more than a dozen until you research Demolition Bots. Demo bots disables a hostile ship's weapons for 60 seconds, IIRC. That makes the Hoshiko a great early counter to enemy HCs. The Hoshikos, being much cheaper than HCs, can be purchased in larger numbers. I once played a game where, by the end, my fleet only had about 30 LRMs and less than 10 Kodiaks, but about 40 Hoshikos with Demo bots on autocast. I went into a battle and within the first minute my Hoshikos had disabled 3/4 of the enemy fleet, and all of his more powerful ships. After I eliminated his cap ships, his crippled fleet was just target practice for LRMs and Kodiaks.

The following is based on *multi-player* experimentation, conversation, and experience only. It doesn't necessarily apply to single-play.

TEC Percherons are the weakest cruiser carriers available. Avoid them if possible.

Hoshinko's heal ability is useful if you micro it and your ships aren't dying too fast. Endgame with large battles it will only really benefit you if you have a lot of Hoshinkos or you are focus-healing a capital ship. Their demo-bot ability is one of two semi-effective TEC counters to Subverter Distortion Field or Guardian Repulsion (excluding bombers).

Cielo Command Cruisers have a useful debuff, but like Hoshinkos can only affect one target at a time.

I'll pop Cobalt Frigates in here just because their Sabotage Reactor ability works really really well against cruiser that uses antimatter (Subverters, Guardians - your main factional terrors mid-late game)

All support cruiser/frigate abilities become more useful when one of the following conditions are met:
1) you turn off the unit's auto-attack (will autocast abilities exclusively on all applicable targets in radius, lessening need for ability micro)
2) the support vessel is grouped with the fleet function with a majority proportion of damage-dealing ships (if you fleet 10 Hoshinkos with two Cobalts they will try to fight rather than heal, as their AI will determine that they make up most of your firepower)
3) you micro. Micro is aided by pinning your fleet to the empire tree and using hotkeys such as number-grouping, Alt-select (selects all units of that type) and Tab (cycles through selected units)

On TEC Cap Ships - Some experienced players open with Colony Caps exclusively regardless of faction. I try to stay away from that with TEC in 1.05. This is the simple reason that I'm not good enough with TEC single-ship abilities to prevail against strong use of Vasari or Advent Area-of-Effect. So if I'm playing TEC it's either to rush or feed income to my Vasari/Advent allies. If I'm rushing I want a Marza (highest straight DPS in the game, incredible siege abilities) or a Sova (Embargo FTW).

If I'm booming I might go Akkan for the early expansion, but it doesn't really matter because early on expansion is limited not by colony ships but by how many colonies I can upgrade with the resources I generate in the first few minutes of play. You don't lose out either way, IMO.

Hoshiko's piss me off the AI on hard, spams them so nothing will die in their fleet. Well it takes forever.

I use Kol as my first cap ship as it can take asteriod defense ships easily with a colony ship sitting at the gravity well beside it.

1. I usually skip the Percheron. Hoshikos are A+ and i dont make any offensive fleet without 10-15 or so, fleet depending.

Main advantage of Tec's are armor and hull points upgrades are cheap. You want to get yourself 4-6 of each. Hoshikos are most effective then. Because of these upgrades, the flak and Heavyy Cruiser can take a beating before they die. The heavy cruisers should be the heart and soul of your attack fleet. While Perchorons are okay in numbers of 4-8, they die too easy if they are singled out and their strike craft are more nice additions rather than backbone of your force. Because of their high tech cost, they just get skipped by me.

2. Your right about the cap ships. I play both styles alot. Akkons and Kols have 3 great low level abilities, but the Kol has the best level 6 (finest hour) so it gets the small edge. Akkons add range and accuracy without any anitmatter (great for LRM fleets) and can disable enemy capital ships (great for killing capital ships!). Their colonize is just... well a small speed booster. Usually you want to send Colony ships after the planet is clean, otherwise AI will jump your colony ship, so just having the planet destroyer be the planet colonizer saves you a good minute or two. For humans, who i dont play, i would say you should always go Kol. Kol is nearly impossible to kill with the shield ability, has highest natural hull/shield points, kills frigates, capital ships and strikecraft (sc with its ability). And get it to level 6 and it can really pump up your local capital ships with its finest hour.

Usually out of wanting my highest level cap to be hard to kill and a natural powerhouse, I go for Kol. I almost always build akkon soon after. Marza's I feel are natural defenders, get them behind some 40hp/sec repair stations, get some bonus antimater from Tec culture power, and its nuke does aoe damage, this guy can put a dent in a larger fleet as long as it can stay alive and juiced up.

Percheons are useless except when massed to some degree, I wouldn't even notice 3-5 of my enemies carriers just sitting around, but 30 are devastating, capapble of ripping apart Capital ships left and right, even when outnumbered, being able to destroy a lower level capital ship before it reaches the carriers is good, added to that, nothing takes down scouting frigates better than a couple fighter squadrons. I typically leave a few in my planet right behind a chokehold to stop scouts and siege frigates, but in my main fleet it's either 30 or nothing. Worthwile to note that they're a great counter to LRM's if somebody's spamming them.

The Akkan level 6 ability (Armistice?) is a 60 second invulnerability for both sides. Has anyone entertained Bomber fleets that jump into an empty system and nuke the heck outa it with an Akkan backup (for bugging out) when a defensive fleet arrives?

This would be separate from your main fleet of course, and taking any alternative route to harrass your enemy.

Actually, Marzas are perfect frigate killers once their Level 6 ability (3000dmg to every taget in a certain range) is fixed. From my experience, Kols are great for killing capships and soaking up damage, Marzas are best for killing frigates and hit-and-run attacks with Raze Planet.

Well, after playing Systems of War, I've come to realize the usefulness of the Percherons and Akkans.

The last enemy AI was massively spamming their Vasari carrier cruisers and they were tearing up my fleet, namely because I didn't have any flak frigates and so could barely defend myself. I responded in kind by creating tons of Percherons myself (plus no less than 4 carrier caps) and dozens of flak frigates. We'll see who's laughing now, fat boy!

I started to rely more and more on the Akkan when I realized just how ridiculously slow the Colony frigate is. It cannot really defend itself and it takes WAY too long to get from A to B, and when you're in a race to get those colonies set up, those Akkans REALLY come in handy.

So, I guess that wraps up this thread, eh?


Mad Cat

Dunov with EMP Charge can eliminate the enemy Hoshikos anti matter. The same strat can really save your rear end if the other guy is using Subverters or Guardians.

The TEC uses excellent caps as one of is main strengths.

Hoshiko is sick, one of the best support ships! The repair ability works in conjunction with high armor! But the best part are demolition bots! Disable weapons for a minute means the enemy ship cant fire! Bring enough hoshikos to disable all enemy heavy cruisers lol. You will have to turn off autocast for the repair and repair manually, also turn off auto attack! That's the only way to get the Autocast from Demolition bots to work properly.

As far as Cielo, if you are using it for designate target you wont need as many, but if you want them to also buff you should get a decent number. Of course the autocast for designate target is pretty bad.

Percheron are weak in small number, even agaist small force. But in quantity, they tear up huge force. Bring some Hoshiko, Cielo, Krosov (To demolish planets) and a Akklan (To colonize planets) and you got an powerful force to bring to galaxy to your knees, an planet after another. Oh! And add Kols and Marza if you can!

I guess saying "Percheons are only awesome in big numbers" is kinda a given, but it's true, combined with a Marza which is capable of taking down Flak Frigates like nothing else, with a little micromanaging they should be able to overwhelm the enemy, they're the only thing I've seen take down a high level Kol with three repair bays (without the need to focus fire on the bays)