Elections

Ron paul.

If you like half-insane racist vagina doctors who tout 17th century economic policy as if it was some gift from the heavens, sure.



haha what gun control crap hasn't been relevant since 1992, there's not enough of a movement FOR it to be an issue

No offense, but this is such a loaded question I'm not warranting a response. If you want to know people's feelings about the election, just ask. Don't say that there is a choice between socialism and a "slight slow down of it." Gross over generalizations that are loaded assumptions don't warrant reply . . . especially when they don't make a whole lot of sense to me.

Except that Obama is a socialist at best and a closet Marxist at worst. Read his commencement address at Wesleyan, e.g.:

"Because our individual salvation depends on collective salvation. Because thinking only about yourself, fulfilling your immediate wants and needs, betrays a poverty of ambition. Because it’s only when you hitch your wagon to something larger than yourself that you realize your true potential and discover the role you’ll play in writing the next great chapter in America’s story."

http://www.wfsb.com/news/16389467/detail.html

Read the whole thing and compare it to the 10 pillars of Communism. The parallels are frightening.


Personally, I think McCain has potential. Unlike Kerry or Hillary, he doesn't change his stated position based on the crowd he's in front of, but based on sensible principles (e.g. not drilling offshore makes sense when oil is cheap and the tech is dirty, but not now when gas is expensive and we can get the oil without harming the environment).

That's the kind of "flip flop" that's a good thing.

Do you deny that it takes more than "fuck u ive got mine!!!!!" philosophy to get anything done? It strikes me as more of a allusion to the "what can your country do for you/what can you do for your country" line.

However you justify a flip flop is up to you. If you were inclined to like Obama more, then you would probably agree that his flip flopping on the issue of public financing for his campaign is fine. Here, you see McCain's flip flop on offshore drilling as timely and commonsensical, but you probably more inclined to think so because you want to. Obama supporters will probably say that his flip flop on campaign funding is because it is commonsensical in trying to win the Presidency and therefore fully justified.

Frankly, it's still a flip flop (for both of them). I don't care what issue it is, but politicians always flip flop while running for office. Even more so when running for the Presidency. It isn't what issue they flip flop on, it is when they do it that matters.

McCain is trying to appeal to the republican base and, I believe, in doing so he is alienating a lot of independent voters who respect(ed) him for his maverick streak. I count myself in that category. For me, McCain went into election mode back when he made amends with Jerry Falwell. You don't call someone an "agent of intolerance" and then make amends with them when running for President. And yes, I am referring way back to his run in 2000 when he denounced the extreme religious right (here, I took the time to find a video).

One last thing, why did you mention Hillary and Kerry when Obama is the nominee? I understand you may have a historical dislike of certain nominees, but not everyone is the same as those who have come before. If that were true then we would refer to all republicans as Nixon.

I'd vote for John McCain: 1) If Obama raises taxes on gas companies, the gas companies will just raise their prices until, even with the tax, they are making the same amount of money as they were before = even higher gas prices, 2) Yea, I too have noticed that most of the hard-core democrats (ie. Hilary + Bill Clinton, Al Gore, Barak Obama, etc.) are VERY, VERY close to Socialism, Communism, and Marxism, which in my opinion is a cause for great worry, 3) If we leave Iraq now, it will have all been for nothing (Vietnam, anyone?). The terrorists + Iran will come back, the Muslims will hate us more, and everything will get worse. Yes, I agree that our invasion tactics weren't the best, but we are seeing progress. And, although there were no WMD found, they could have easily been moved to Syria or Iran. And isn't saving millions of innocent people who were being executed by their cruel dictator the right thing to do.

On a side note: The Iraq war has had less casualties than all wars we have fought in except the following: the Revolutionary War, the Gulf War, and I believe it's the Spanish-American War. However, the % of our population which has been killed in each war has been significantly higher than that of the Iraq war (with the one exception being the 1st Gulf War)

(I'm a Consevative from Idaho.)

macain all the way but if we pull out from iraq adn then alqueda won against 2 superpowers the ussr and the us so they we become powerful fast

Obama seems to have too many inconsistencies. I agree he does sound a little Marxist. However, I don't like McCain much better. He flip flops and panders just like the rest of them. If you ask me we need to get rid of republicans and democrats no party should have the power those two have. Also, we should limit presidential terms to just one term since it seems that whoever is elected does relatively well in the first term but begins to push their own agenda in the second. (Conservative from Wisconsin, yes they do exist)

Btw, so far this thread hasn't turned into a flame war (and subsequently killed my a mod), which is nice.

whiteknight, were you aware that the Confederacy only had one term Presidents? (Theoretically speaking, not that they were able to have multiple presidents.) For six years I believe. And I agree that two terms really hinder the Presidency. You get three years, then spend a year trying to get elected again, two or three years of doing whatever they want (and Congress battling them or writing blank checks) and then a year or so of a lame duck. So, five or six years out of eight is pretty limiting. It could be worse, though.

I shall reluctantly vote for McCain.

I am a life-long Conservative (I voted for Richard Nixon my first time.)

Obama is bringing an old Jimmy Car-tah agenda that didn't work then and sure won't work now.

What really might work is clean out all politicians on both sides and start over but that is just a fancy.

I am starting to believe in term limits...

Two different looking sides of the same coin...

Clearly, somebody who's served four years as a Senator and somebody who's served twenty are exactly the same.

I agree with white knight there should be no political parties and one term limits for everyone to reduce the amount of corrupting power anyone can have

I think he meant the political parties, and then subsequently the politicians.



One term for a lot of positions would be a bit too short. I think the Presidency, based on the amount of power vested in that position (and growing every day, ugh) should be limited a whole heck of a lot more than a senator.

I personally am a conservative but i cant bring myself to vote for McCain. If i had my choice I'd vote for Ron Paul but hes not running so im left with one alternative. Libertarian. Bob Barr for President! Personally, I wish we could bring the Founding Fathers back to see how far off we are from their visions and try to put us back on the right path little government interference.

Hey, just pick the lesser of 2 evils. (McCain; don't flame me people)

If you go voting for Independants, Obama is sure to win. (Not that I can say that I really like McCain, but He'll do...)

"You mean, it comes from a world of lizards?"
"No," said Ford, who by this time was a little more rational and coherent than he had been, having finally had the coffee forced down him, "nothing so simple. Nothing anything like to straightforward. On its world, the people are people. The leaders are lizards. The people hate the lizards and the lizards rule the people."
"Odd," said Arthur, "I thought you said it was a democracy."
"I did," said ford. "It is."
"So," said Arthur, hoping he wasn't sounding ridiculously obtuse, "why don't the people get rid of the lizards?"
"It honestly doesn't occur to them," said Ford. "They've all got the vote, so they all pretty much assume that the government they've voted in more or less approximates to the government they want."
"You mean they actually vote for the lizards?"
"Oh yes," said Ford with a shrug, "of course."
"But," said Arthur, going for the big one again, "why?"
"Because if they didn't vote for a lizard," said Ford, "the wrong lizard might get in. Got any gin?"
- Douglas Adams

^^Nice, Gambler.

Perfect actually...   

McCain is such a twit it's going to hurt voting for him, but as said, pick the lesser of two evils.

One unfair point that has been made for McCain though. The oil bit is not a flip flop. His position remains, what changed is the views of the states that weren't interested in offshore drilling. Leaving it up to the states means drilling off the shore of Florida was a no no last year and a hell yes right now, they went from 60/40 against to 80/20 for in that time span.

Plenty of reasons to loathe voting for him without making more up.

Question, why no mention of black liberation theology yet? I'd think a black KKK philosophy would be as much of a negative as being socialist.

McCain would bbetter appreciate those in the military, all of whom put their lives on the line to defend democracy, therefore I would DEFINATLY choose him! He will also keep us in Iraq, wich MUST be done!

I would much rather McCain be president than Obama because pulling out of Iraq before the job is done would be wasting all the lives that have been lost in this war, and not to say it's not horrible we lost more troops in D-day.

we should just stay there forever then!

"welp we lost 200k people but WILL WE ALLOW THOSE DEATHS TO BE IN VAIN"

stop bumping this stupid thread