Entrenchment - Will it make games even longer???

I think yes. At least as soon as starbases being built (which would be late game anyway). But then you might need to modify your fleet to crack this thing (providing you can't jump around this bottleneck). Or you'll have to reroute your attacks.

IMHO, if you play online/LAN long enough to build starbases the additional amount of time needed to complete a game doesn't matter anymore ;-D

I think so too...

But this could indeed be double-edged knife hmmm...

We will see

Frankly my dear I don't give a damn.

As long as it adds defensive deapth to the game. Makes for a more complete space rts experiance.

Just for you short gamers. It's not going anywhere. The short game will still be around only more interesting. So need not worry eh!

After Entrenchment focusing on defense, and something named like Compulsion with extra diplomacy and piracy options, the third expansion will probably be called Onslaught, and give massively powerful new offensive options.

BTW, is it me, or will the Vasari be a bit uber in Entrenchment, with their Kostura cannon and Marauder phasing? Heehe, me like

Can the Kostura target stars or uncolonizable grav wells?  I don't play Vasari enough to know?

Just tell me if that's a stupid question. hahaha

The new defenses might lengthen games -- or the ability to free up ships and resources to the offensive might help shorten it, by making it more difficult for 'underdogs' to dig their way out of a hole.

No! But if it doesn't get an update, it won't crack a starbase anyway. In 1.05 and 1.1 it takes 5 or more Costuras shooting at simultanously to even destroy ordinary structures and ships.

Hey!

Stay on topic you silly lot  

how do you get all your kostura cannons to fire at once?

you cant but you can get them pretty close. I played on gateway and had all my planets in the extra system fire the cannons suffice it to say i beat 4 AIs allied against me

On the topic how much does the starbase cost and do you slowly upgrade it spending more?

Good question...

Also, would all Entrenchment elements be part of the "late game" so to speak or will we be able to use some or most of expansion pack add-ons from the start?

But anyway - main question still remains!!!

Will Entrenchment make online MP games even longer as they are now???

I feel like bit of a Hamlet over here - but hey

Well, Starbases will definitely be late-game. I believe it was mentioned that they'd be the most expensive thing in the game. And superweapons are fairly pricy, especially for the early/mid game

Sure...

But how about mines and other stuff?

And I would really LOVE to hear word from either IC or SD in regards to game length... 

What are initial tests showing in lets say classic 2v2 - 1 star - 20 planets scenario... Rough average on map like this is about hour and half or there about (at least according to my experience) will we be looking at any difference in regards to this average time?

In balanced game where both sides end up with star bases and other defensive stuff will this push average game length to some obscure numbers or perhaps not...

I find this rather important to be honest!

I agree with Nephilim that game lenght is very important.

I am not planning on getting Entrenchment right away...But I will avoid it completely if it adds to the game lenth.

I already have an EXTREMLY hard time playing online, which I belive to be ten times funner than against AI.

i would like to hope that at least some of the defensive upgrades would be available ealry and mid game and not just late game... like you could upgrade your factories and basic defenses right near the start or atleast upgrade them a bit and then upgrade more as you progress through the game.... but we'll just have to wait and see i guess...

the easiest way (and closest) is to select all of them, zoom in on the planet you want to bombard, and order it to fire, hit tab, next fires, tab, fires, tab, fires, tab, etc.

I would not think it would extend the length of games. you would pour as many resources into a starbase as a sizeable defence fleet, so not much new there. So, you might have The Bloody Death Star in your back yard but in order to do that, thats one less fleet you have working for you, meaning your chances to expand and redeploy to defend your fringe worlds diminishes.

However, if the mines are like those of the Starfire series, and have a "dash" capability, then fields of them surronding the enemy entrance phase line should be able to hold a fringe system.

yes, games will be longer, unless you're playing a 1v1 and the other player lrm or assailant spams you.

Entrenchment will make it nearly impossible for anyone to rush a person and live to tell the tale. The starbases force players to build supermassive fleets to take down a planet/gravwell and their starbase. This brings turtling back to the table and will allow for epicly decisive ship-to-ship or ship-to-base battles. of course, they might have to change the firepower of most ships to make it so that a massive fleet could actually stand up to a starbase with defenses.

TEC will pwn!!

Quote FTW!

Glad I am not the only one...

I mean I simply love this game and I have already pre-ordered Entrenchment but I am simply concerned that defensive toys which are about to get introduced will further slow down online game which is waaaaaay too slow as it is anyway...

I play SP as well so I am sure I will be happy with expansion pack even if it totally kills online aspect...

But just like you, online MP is my priority and if expansion pack turns average 2hr game into average 4hr game then someone here is surely missing the point

Can't say much about the duration of games. A lot will come down to how the beta goes. We'll adapt based on feedback. However, in reference to other comments: the Kostura Cannon has been redesigned and IMO is much cooler and useful.

-Blair

Hi man

Thanks for reply! - and yes, Beta will give us the answer for sure...

However, I hope you won't mind me asking you one more question...

In case online MP becomes considerably longer due to extra juice you are adding to the game via expansion(s) will you be thinking about creating extra game mode or two with different winning conditions which would focus at magic number of 30-45 minutes per round in order to save online aspect of the game?

Hard question to answer over the forums - i know... - it is just that many people out there (I personally know few dozens!) have stopped playing Sins not because game is bad but because online game is way too long...

Perhaps you were already thinking about stuff like this!?

I know that majority play SP but that majority was shaped by game design itself and not by their own choice - hell, I mainly play SP too but not because I want to but because I often haven't got more than 1hr to play a game... In some other games this would easily equal to two online rounds while in Sins I don't even log in into ICO without at least 2 hours spare...

This has been major issue for many! - trust me... 

I might start a new thread with some game mode ideas

I started a map that had a whole bunch of reasearch station already under player control when I started the game. The game progressed extreamly fast. That would decreace game time dramatically on most games played.