Power supply-Graphics Card compatibility

Dys, i wasn't referring specifically to OEM built stuff in my "general" comment above; i was simply trying to warn that between a system tested on the assembly line by a company that has a reputation to protect by building solid & reliable PCs (as a whole and with good specifications that fit one's needs out-of-the-box, btw) and a scrap job made by uninformed or mislead JoeSchmoes (not implying anyone is, but like the OP says - shit happens!) i'd take the former if only to be absolutely sure a PC is & remains stable for the initial higher cost of having even, a fair warrenty attached product.

Card X wants PSU ++... but mobo *may_as in might be IF* suffer a gradual burnout condition -- is and always will be pretty common in this DIY gear fascination about overpowered Towers.

It's simply good practice (for anybody) to VERIFY a system *true* specs and capacities before borking an otherwise great machine only to gain a few tiny cpu-clock spins & a couple of FPS speed throughs by bending head over heels to corporation X and its splendid 125$ worth of 250W more of rail hikes that COULD kill the entire stuff slowly.

Say, in theory... actual PC=1500$, adding ONE better VideoCard=75$, changing 400W to 750W PSU=125$ -- three months later = Zero value cuz mobo has blown up!

Buy new (OEM or DIY) with latest techno stuff already in; upcoming new PC=2000$ (less selling return on the previous gear which is still in good condition!) is certainly something to think about - IF someone has patience or money to spend or waste.

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Well, just a small addition; it IS possible to run nearly any GPU on a 500W PSU, the question is how long it will last. (Trust me, I've run a 4870X2 (which requires power and then some) on an FSP 450W PSU and an E8400. (I'm a computer component tester, so I deal with this stuff at a daily basis, so you wont need a 750+W for your system, a 500-550 will be enough. As a great example, you should check http://www.corsair.com/_images/charts/tx650w_efficiency.jpg which shows the effieciency during different load levels of a modern day PSU.

Now, the calculations made by harpo99999 in the first post are damn much off, as the values are simply wrong. Check the wattage of your CPU, this is the TDP. (Which is a guideline for cooling, and any modern CPU very rarely goes over that, even at full load - overclocking is another thing however, as you increase the voltage you might need to calculate whether the wattage of your CPU increases.)
And a motherboard; you can't (CAN'T!) say as simple as "oh, it'll use around 30W", because it depends a lot on what functions you are using (you got a card in every PCI/PCIe slot in your computer? didn't think so ^^), load, etc. etc. etc.

And what the heck, GF8600GT - 200W? That's so wrong it's almost sad. "Each GeForce GTX 280 can consume up-to 237 Watts per card when 100% stressed." (From Guru3D) An 8600GT (or 9800GTX+ for that matter) consumes nowhere near those numbers. "Power consumption for the GeForce 8600GT is around 50-watts for the clock speeds indicated above (stock)" (from hardwareanalysis.com)

And as the punchline; read http://www.pcper.com/article.php?aid=580&type=expert&pid=7 as they put it to the test. The system they're running (a relatively high-end one) AT FULL LOAD CONSUMES 303W!
If you're running a decent 500-550W that's well within the margins of how much one of those puts out. (Though, yes, you have to check whether each rail can put out the necessary amperage.) And you can even include some wear and tear to that, since you still got some marginals.

This is definately the biggest thing people can't seem to understand in the computer business, how to see power consumption and to calculate what PSU you might need. Also, if you want to give it a go yourself, go buy a power consumption meter (plugs into your wall outlet and then you'll just have to insert the PC power cable into that - do not include the monitor) and see for yourself. Gee.

Funny to see another computer business professional saying the exact same thing too ^^ And as another note, yeah, the 4850 is just a little below the 9800GTX+ and consumes a lot less power, so if you want a more efficient card, go for it

A few updates/respond to quotes;

"900W is good for gaming" - yeah sure, if you run a triple-SLI/Crossfire system with an i7 or so. I'm running a GTX295+Core2Duo E8600 plus 4gb Corsair Dominator PC8500 (at 2.1V, so they're quite beefy, power consumption-wise) and all that on a 750W Corsair TX750. Running smooth as silk, and although I haven't measured the exact wattage I know it's nowhere near 750W.

"Just for example, looking at a basic Antec 550 PSU (not 80PLUS, so while a bit exaggerated, the same rule still applies), it claims to offer three 12v rails, at 22A/22A/25A, which totals to 828W." - Yes, and this is due to somewhat dynamic rails (not fully separated), and is meant for management, so you can control a little where the load goes. (Literally, not metaphorically...)

Also, the 828W may be closer to what the PSU could actually put out (would it operate at maximum effiency, which it probably would do 1/1000 times, in 1/100 of the cases...), and the W rating the PSU has is more for safety and margin than anything else. There are some manufacturers that have done the other way around, and gone with the Amperage rating and then saying the PSU can handle a certain wattage based on that as well. This, however, will almost certainly lead to a fried PSU and/or components. (Anyone remember Q-Tec, hm? You know what I mean...)

But yes, a single rail PSU is safer, because you know a little bit better how much you have (if you're bright enough to read the specs before playing around...) to play with.

And another bottom line; Yes, a PSU can fry your computer, but as long as you buy a good one (research is the key) you're basically safe. And regarding the OEM vs. home built; you can buy and upgrade your system just as well as a factory or company could do, as the principles stay the same. If you know what you're doing and are careful and thorough you can achieve just as good (or better) result.

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Quoting kyonu,

reply 25

And for those who keep saying you need a 750+ watt PSU, please, stop saying that. I'm a computer tech for a low-pro computer store

What store is that....remind me to never refer anybody there.

Obviously you didn't read the link I left above for "read this" it explains why you should run a larger PSU than you NEED.

Yes a most 500-550W supplies will run his system, I am not arguing that. I am merely suggesting that to be SAFELY powered AFTER the PSU ages it is best to run a larger than needed PSU.

the way I see it is You can spend ~$75 on a 500W and replace it every year to avoid the dangers of aging. Or you can spend ~$120-200 on something larger with more aging room that will last for 5 years. Also allowing upgrades/new builds without having to purchase yet another PSU.

It's not about his system NEEDS 750W to run. A system will ONLY draw the power it needs, just because its a larger supply than what he needs does not mean it will supply all that power at all times. If my system NEEDED 750W 60A, I'D be running a 1000W+ 90-100A.

It is about the FACT that PSUs over time lose upto 30% of output ability. and that time can be as little as 1 year or as long as 5+ years depending on quality, the average is 3 years.so choice is yours, run a 500w that iwll run your system and risk 30% lose in possibly 1 year, that will most likely cost you a new VGA card and or mainboard when it goes. Or run a larger PSU and KNOW your safe even if htat 30% is lost 1 year later.

that Antec PSU you linked is a good PSU for its capacity. However it is only about a 35A PSU. If his system needs 26-30A it doesn't give him much room for capacitor aging that WILL happen and take out his system when it does.

Thus the recommendation for a 750W 60A or at least something pushing 45-50A. which will allow some room for aging and not take out that new VGA card in the near future. A good rule to follow is that whatever your power NEEDS are, buy at least 30% larger to allow you to be safely powered even when again occurs and you lose 20-30% of output ability.

as well it is not wise to run a PSU above 70% of its output ability EVEN UNDER FULL LOAD. You are best having a PSU that runs at 50-60% under normal load reaching no more than 70% when your system is under full load for extended periods. this will age it faster due to heat.

It is ONLY about the watts because watts are needed to provide the AMPs. The real thing you NEED to look at is the AMP output. because wattage can be configured in a variety of AMP outputs.

5 years ago I had a 420W Antec PSU pushing 19A, when it died it was replaced with a 410W 26A Enermax. See my point 10 less watts 6 more Amps. by the same token a 500W PSU can be configured anywhere from ~26A up to 41A.

ONLY A FOOL who wants to lose his system pays attention to just the watts, and not the AMP output.

750WA is a LOT of power, mainly since 90% of them on the market are 80+ certified, giving it a longer-lasting drive, since it's peak at 80+ is like, 825WA or some junk.

LOL...I think you are a little confused on efficiency rating.

80+ certified has NOTHING to do with how much power the PSU will put out in relation to it's peak output ability.

80+ Efficiency rating ONLY means that 80%+ of the voltage coming into the PSU from the wall will be converted watts to then provide the amp output. the remaining ~20% of power coming into the PSU is lost to heat in the coversion process which is why electric components run warm/hot.

It DOES NOT determine ANYTHING about how much power the PSU will actually put out or at what percentage of peak wattage.

It does however play a part in the life of the PSU as you said "longer lasting drive" but this is only due to the better the efficiency the cooler the PSU will operate, thus the heat will age it slower, which is critical especially if you run at peak.

Then there is the operating tempurature at which the efficiency rating was given. That too discussed prior in my last post and the link. Maybe you should read it.

or if you want something with a bit more kick,

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817703005 would be more than you would ever need for a mainstream video card,

Well now your on the right track. a DAMN good PSU and yes would be ample for his needs.

LMAO....But I have to wonder....you say a 750W is "A LOT of power" Yet do you realize that the 610W PC Power in your link is actually about the same as 99% of 670W PSUs.

Thats right.....99% of companies rate a PSU at its PEAK wattage, such as most 500W PSU are 500W peak output but really run closer to 450W continuous tapping into the other 50W when needed.

PC Power is the only company that I know of (may be a couple others) that rates their PSUs at CONTINUOUS wattage. that 610W is 610W continuous, 670W peak.

It's also a 49A output which will allow some room for capacitor aging and still be safely powered, though not quite as much safety as a ~60A supply.

so really one of your own recommnedations is only 70W/ upto 5.8A smaller that what your telling us is "A LOT of power". is that too a lot of power????

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I'm a little weary of brand new boards, but that 250 looks like a great budget gamer card. Maybe I will wait.

I intended this PC only lasting to next year, when I'll probably get an entirely new build as the price for Quad Cores or even maybe Processors with the Diamon lattice (Or whatever it's called) starts becomming mainstream and fairly inexpensive (Artificial diamond compound allows for less heat or somesuch, I'm not fully in on the details).

It's not so much the cards, it's just the lack of support for ATI, maybe they've changed since the days I am talking abou t(Like 100% they have) but it's still makes me wary, Nvidia hasn't really let me down, and until they do, I have no particular reason to change.

Karma!

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hats right.....99% of companies rate a PSU at its PEAK wattage, such as most 500W PSU are 500W peak output but really run closer to 450W continuous tapping into the other 50W when needed.

PC Power is the only company that I know of (may be a couple others) that rates their PSUs at CONTINUOUS wattage. that 610W is 610W continuous, 670W peak.

90% of bad companies, you can find out the peak with simple calculation, I run away from any PSU so far that has that calculation come out to it's labeled max DC output.

I'm a bit rusty, I have it written down, I think the forumal was like V * A = Peak or something along those lines (Combine of all the rails, the 12V's usually hold about 2/3 the power though)

ANY PSU that has the Max DC output below, at or very close to the result of that calculation should be avoided at all costs.

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Black curtain, obviously you don't understand how power supplies work. Those two power supplies I listed in my links are well enough to do whatever. I don't care about your "MUST BE BIGGER" mentality, but I've been running the same CoolerMaster eXtreme Power 500wa with my 4870 for almost a year now (Right when it was released), and the power supply I've had for nearly two years, and it's more than enough. Just because it has more wattage doesn't mean it will last longer. My buddy's Enermax Galaxy 850Wa went out just after two months of a single 8800GT video card in it, and that was the most power consuming thing he was running!

And 80+ efficiency is how much the PSU works at, not how much the PSU draws from the wall. If you do the research, an 80+ efficiency means it will run at 80% efficiency load or better on a continuous rate, low load, or high load. If it drops below 80%, it loses that rating, and wouldn't be badged. All the power supplies I list are going to be 80+. All the power supplies I list are going to be power supplies listed at their continuous output, not their main output. Per that Earthwatts 500wa Antec, that is a continuous PSU, not a max-load. It's max is about 615watts.

AMPS are what I do look at, watts are just a measurement of a combination of amps. However, I use watts for the original poster, as he doesn't know much about power supplies, so I gave him a "good wattage at 80+ efficiency" since most 80+ power supplies run at more, at max load, then basic power supplies.

ALso,

Quoting blackcurtain,

reply 3

LMAO....But I have to wonder....you say a 750W is "A LOT of power" Yet do you realize that the 610W PC Power in your link is actually about the same as 99% of 670W PSUs.

Like I said, the 610wa is more than he will ever need for a mainstream computer. Obviously you didn't catch that snippet.

And lastly, amps are a good thing to look at, but most mainstream video cards like the 9800GTX+ will not suck as much power as you think. That simple Antec Earthwatts 500WA will be perfect for it.

NEVER use any of those website PSU Calculators, as they will never give you the correct power correction. I did a test one day, with using an AMD 9850BE overclocked to 3.2Ghz, and crossfire'd two HD4870's, with two Velociraptor HDD's, a soundcard, BD-rom, high-end Mobo... The corsair calculator said my Antec True Power Trio 550WA should power it no problem. That rating is at a continuous standard, and it's peak is 610watts, so it should have been more than enough, when the calculator listed 500WA (plus only 32amps, and the PSU label states it has 34 amps). I put all the stuff in as a test, turned it on, and it lasted about 5 minutes before it shut it self down. Tried it again, same thing. It doesn't work as simple as "using a calculator." Use what the sites recommend for the PSU, or even scrounge forums. (Don't use the box labelling; the HD4870 X2 lists it'll work on a 450wa PSU. It won't!)

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Zydor

Join Date 03/2006

+38

I run a 9800GTX+ on a Phenom II 940, I have a 700W Enermax PSU from its original build 3 years ago (was a FX60 with twin 7800GTXs SLI), and its boarderline now that the case has a new motherboard, card and quad cpu. Does it run? Yes it does, but there are times when I hit a peak or attach lots of ancillaries like external hard disks, cameras, printers, headphones yaddie yadda - all the stuff we plug in these days without thinking, and it groans a bit at times. I do run climate prediction models on the quad cpu's, therefore its running at full capacity. In the latter you may find salvation in that if the cpus are not running at full load permanently - and they rarely do (permanently) on gaming - then there is less draw on power.

However, I still would be strongly against trying to run a 9800GTX with multi core cpus on less than 650/700W, its too risky because the PSU will step down the voltage as its overstressed - not a good thing for many parts of a PC. It will look as if you have "got away with it" - you havent, it shortens (drastically) component life as inadequate power is supplied. Extra expense it maybe, but the consequencies are too real to risk. The priority in any power rig or where maximum bang for the buck is saught has to be a decent power supply, the rest follows on, on an as afforded basis. Theoretical figures and anicdotals based on less than 100% use of capacity are placing the PC at long term risk, which is not a good idea given the relative small cost of a PSU to the cost of the whole rig.

Dont do it - upgrade the PSU.

Regards
Zy

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i'm wondering how many of you guys advocating higher max-power PSUs use or don't use a UPS as well. clean AC in will give you a much, much more reliable PSU.

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Compare this system I just built for around $1000.00 total cost to include xp pro x64

click image to view system

Intel DP45SG motherboard, Intel Q8200 Core 2 Quad CPU, EVGA 9600 GSO Graphics Card, 2x2MB G-Skill RAM, Cool Master V8 CPU Cooler and a Sigma La Vie Case with included 500watt powersupply.

We checked the ratings for the power supply and all componets before we decided to use as such. Thus everything comes to a fair balance with just 1 hard drive and a cd/dvd drive in use. Case has 2 fans 1 on the side and 1 at the rear. The cpu cooler does use much either. But the big factor was that the power supply itself had a 6 pin PCie plug with needed amps to supply this card with. Alot of people do not like this card for some reasons I do not agree with. As far as that goes the gaming system itself I built here is running very well with not one error on startup to the running of even a hard game such as crysis in medium mode. That or any other game that she [ my daughter ] uses for her new computer.

My opinion is that you not buy a new computer - but that you build a new gaming computer and unlike the OS we used here [due to the fact my daughter does not like Vista at all! ] I would install Vista x64 and be happy with a fair shake for a new cheap gaming rig that works.

There are many ways to go with the design of any gaming computer. If you want to spend money it is as easy as that. But if you want to do it cheap and good still - there is a way to do it. Most all OEM manufactures do it as this to make the money from you when you buy. But why give them your money if you can do the same and have just as good or at that even better.

All I say is good luck and if you want some opinions just drop me a line at my email address found in my profile here at WC.

GT

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Zydor

Join Date 03/2006

+38

The whole thing is a risk judgement, ie how much anyone is prepared to take. With the system he is going for 800/850 is crazily high, way over the top. 650/700 is usual for good reason all based on max power useage with some to spare for future beastie upgrades.

Can it run on lower - yup for sure, its just a case of how much the beastie is going to be used, whether it will ever hit max cpu useage, and the amount of risk anyone is prepared to take - and whichever way you cut it, 500w is a considerable risk. The complicating factor is that everyone uses their beast for different purposes and loads are different. Its also the case that PSUs do try to protect by stepping down, hiding latent damage, the latter is ok as an "emergency" short term measure, not good for long term use.

At the end of the day everyone has to make a risk call if buying in at boarderline - less than 600/650w on that one is getting to boarderline territory. It may well work fine for the use he puts to it - only the actual user can make the call. All I would say is the judgement is made on sober facts, then arrive at a conclusion, not search for facts to justify a pre-set wish. The recycle bins are full of the result of getting this wrong, thats without going down the hassle road of crashes and BSODs due to inadequate, therefore unstable, power supplies. On a tight budget its not easy to make the call - we've all been there at some point - but whatever else is a factor, a cold sober risk judgement is the priority call, not wish list, its crucial when in boarderline territory.

Regards
Zy

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To Zydor, I have a 550wa PSU, but its a real power pro from coolermaster, and my system without too many perph's is barely loaded at max. I do believe the 9850BE uses a touch more power, and I know my HD 4870does. Though there is one major diffrerence; your PSU is 3 years old, mine is about 1.5 years old. 700 would still be overkill.

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Quoting kyonu,

reply 6

Black curtain, obviously you don't understand how power supplies work. Those two power supplies I listed in my links are well enough to do whatever. I don't care about your "MUST BE BIGGER" mentality, but I've been running the same CoolerMaster eXtreme Power 500wa with my 4870 for almost a year now (Right when it was released), and the power supply I've had for nearly two years, and it's more than enough. Just because it has more wattage doesn't mean it will last longer. My buddy's Enermax Galaxy 850Wa went out just after two months of a single 8800GT video card in it, and that was the most power consuming thing he was running!

And 80+ efficiency is how much the PSU works at, not how much the PSU draws from the wall. If you do the research, an 80+ efficiency means it will run at 80% efficiency load or better on a continuous rate, low load, or high load. If it drops below 80%, it loses that rating, and wouldn't be badged. All the power supplies I list are going to be 80+. All the power supplies I list are going to be power supplies listed at their continuous output, not their main output. Per that Earthwatts 500wa Antec, that is a continuous PSU, not a max-load. It's max is about 615watts.

Look asshole, don't presume to tell me I don't understand how power supplies work. I am not some techy like you that throw parts together to build rinky-dink computers, my 10 year old boy can do that. I come from a family full of electrical industry workers ranging from electrical assemblers to engineers. I think you should let go of your "I know everything attitude" and maybe you might learn something.

I NEVER do use online calculators I was merely using them as an example for the capacitor aging section and to explain WHY it is there.It is there for the FACT that PSUs WILL lose output ability over time due to internal componets aging such as the capacitors, the hotter they run the faster they age. Thus for those who do use the calculators, the capicitor aging section is there for a purpose of adding a little wattage to the recommend to allow for aging of the PSU.

Read my posts again...I did NOT say that a 500W was not large enough to power the system. What I said was WHEN THAT 500W LOSES OUTPUT ABILTY IT WILL TAKE OUT YOUR COMPONENTS WITH IT. BY USING A LARGER SUPPLY YOU SAFEGARD FROM THAT HAPPENING!! As far as making the PSU last longer that is up to the quality of the PSU. sure every one has the chance of malfuntion and can die at anytime, BUT if you run a 500W you are running closer to peak wattage which means running less efficient and hotter, which will in turn help to shorten the life of the PSU, You keep the psu running a little more efficient and cooler you can help it reach it's full life potential.

You are safegarded because when that 500w 35A PSU loses output ability of UP TO 30% it will be just like having a 350W ~25A at which point the system is now in danger of being under powered (depending on hardware config). If you run a largar supply you will still be safely powered and not risk losing components after aging. YOUR CHOICE, keep on going the way you are and sooner or later you will lose something, probably a nice new VGA card. AGAIN the larger supply is NOT because the system NEEDS that power it is for safe power AFTER your PSU loses output ability.

I DID NOT say efficieny is how much power the PSU draws from the wall.

I said efficiency is HOW MUCH OF THAT POWER THAT IS COMING IN FROM THE WALL TO THE PSU IS CONVERTED FOR OUTPUT FOR THE SYSTEM THE REST IS LOST TO HEAT. (IE. how much of that power is wasted/lost) for example if a psu is rated 75% efficient, if that psu is putting out 300W of power to the system it will use 400W to produce that 300W output and 100W are lost to heat in the conversion, assuming it is running at 75% efficiency. This is your "how much the PSU works at"

Thus the PSU is EFFICIENTLY using 75% of incoming power.

as well the efficiency of the PSU will fluxuate depending on the load % the psu is running at and the condition of its componets such as capacitors etc...the older and more aged the psu is the less efficient it will be.

maybe you should take a look here from a quick search. scroll down to "High Efficieny Power Supplies"

anyone who runs a PSU at above 80% of it's rated output (or tapping into it's peak wattage) is a FOOL and doing ONLY 1 thing....aging it faster due to running hotter because more incoming power is being wasted/lost to heat rather than being utilized by the system, and we all know heat is an electrical componets killer. Your BEST efficiency on a good PSU is in the 50-70% operating range of its output ability such as is diagrammed in this link from PeTTs0n also where a nice 750 helps alittle vs a 500W. if your system needs 400W and your running a 500w PSU your gonna run at about 80% of output, my 750 will run the same 400W demanding system at ~53% of output which inturn my 750 will run more efficient than your 500W, running cooler, aging slower and lasting longer. Unless you can run from a 230V source which will allow for a little better efficiency at higher loads

but believe whatever you wish techy parts swapper.

have it your way and let me know when your aging PSU takes out your VGA card so I can laugh my ass off.

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Fuzzy Logic

Join Date 05/2002

+493

Look asshole

There's no need for personal attacks

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right now fuzzy I really don't care. maybe you should read the first 2 lines of what I quoted.

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I did not know this was going to turn into an elitist flamewar. Probably another reason not many more people are serious PC gamers.

I'm waiting for the GT250 anyway, drastically reduced power consumption, and there's a 1GB model, though I doubt I have any games that'll utilize that much, it's only about 20 bucks more so wtfr?

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blackcurtain is spot on . Why anyone willing to drop 300 to 500 bucks on a graphics card, but cheap out on the PSU is beyond me. (<-This was not directed at the OP). The PSU is the most important part of your PC, don't skimp on it.

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Compare this system I just built for around $1000.00 total cost to include xp pro x64

with included 500watt powersupply.

Do you have any idea who made that power supply? Can you find out from the manufacturer?

Using a PSU that comes with a case can be asking for disaster. Not because it is a 500w PSU, yes the 500 will run the system though as stated in this thread I would recommend something a little larger. If you don't want 700W+ try the PC Power 610 it will still allow a little aging safety room.

It can be asking for disaster because the vast majority of PSU included with cases are the cheapest they can find. Cheapest as in quality of engineering and assembly which tend to die very young or even catch on fire.

please Shelby for the sake of your new system read this from JonnyGuru. no it's not the same PSU but this is the exact type of PSU that comes with cases.

BTW..Nice system hope you enjoy it.

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Quoting VarekRaith,

reply 16

blackcurtain is spot on . Why anyone willing to drop 300 to 500 bucks on a graphics card, but cheap out on the PSU is beyond me. (<-This was not directed at the OP). The PSU is the most important part of your PC, don't skimp on it.

As a avid hardware techie myself, i have to agree the psu is the most important (closely followed by the mobo, imo). Im not sure if this was mentioned in a previous post, but there is the possible mis interpretation regarding the quantity of 12v rails. Essentially, multiple 12v rails insure safety n overclocking by seperating the power, ie. 1x 12v rail to mobo + cpu and the other to the video card. The drawback is, the more rails, the lest amps for each rail, thusly if overclocked, or just really demanding hardware, could cause problems. Get quality psu, not a cheap value one. I myself use the Corsair TX750w w/ 1x 12v rail. Its powering a q9550 E0 to 4.02 ghz cooled by a thermalright ultra 120 ex, 4gig of Corsair dominator ram, ATI 4870 1gig, Asus p5e deluxe x48 mobo to name a few. My rule of thumb tho with a new build, have the quality / speed roughly even throughout, cuz a lesser peice of hardware will just bottle neck the rest. Example: 2gig 533mhz ram with a qx9750.

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Fuzzy Logic

Join Date 05/2002

+493

I did not know this was going to turn into an elitist flamewar. Probably another reason not many more people are serious PC gamers.

Exactly. I'm pleased you've not been put off by an immature minority though

Hopefully you can see the wood through the trees and get a card/PSU combination which suits you

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Do you have any idea who made that power supply? Can you find out from the manufacturer?

NOand YES - BC - but I made my own test with the power supply before deciding to use it. Everything is stable and I monitor the system during hard use and no problems thus far and I have mostly life time warranty on everything here in the system. So I'm too worried.

But as I said - it was tested well under heavy loads and no problems voltage changes or spikes.

I do not encourage anyone else to do the same with other riggs without rigorous testing first. Each is going to be different!

GT

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I use the HIS Radeon ICEQ turbo 4850 video card, and it does everything i need it to, very reasonable in price, i do a lot of graphics/photo work on mine and this card handles it without a problem at all, one thing i did invest in for 60 dollars is a temp/fan control system, it goes in a 5 1/2 drive bay, with 4 temperature sensors you place where you want, and you can also adjust the fan speeds, it gives a nice digital readout of the 4 temp sensors, plus it makes your rig look really good as well

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Zydor

Join Date 03/2006

+38

To Zydor, I have a 550wa PSU, but its a real power pro from coolermaster, and my system without too many perph's is barely loaded at max. I do believe the 9850BE uses a touch more power, and I know my HD 4870does. Though there is one major diffrerence; your PSU is 3 years old, mine is about 1.5 years old. 700 would still be overkill.

I have a four hard drive array, and an external PC powered SSD, as well as all the other usual clagage, hence the 700w is groaning a bit - its an enermax so its a stable quality PSU with a good output - as the quad cpus are always running at 100% permanently.

It just depends on the use each individual puts the beastie to, but on any measure 500w is cutting it fine and I would not recommend it.

Regards
Zy

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Well if Blackcurtain is going the route of "I'm better than you and you can't do anything about it", then I will no longer debate with him about it, and I will not read his post. There is no need for insults.

That is true, Zydor, a 700w Enermax at that time, with that particular setup would be pretty stressing. I bought this Antec 1000wa Quattro PSU a while back on sale for 150 bux, maybe I should go stress that thing out.

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There is no need for insults.

You insulted him first. Had you read any of his previous posts, you wouldn't have insinuated that his knowledge was lacking.

blackcurtain and I already clashed in another thread on PSUs, and we managed to both come away from it for the better-I'm unaware why you two weren't able to do so in this instance, as you both have valid points.

Back to the original question-you can run it on your current PSU, but again, I would recommend undervolting and possibly underclocking your CPU, and you will probably need to replace the PSU at some point in time. And don't even think about replacing/adding other components without upgrading the PSU first.

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thank you Sole Soul

kyonu....I do apologize for the asshole remark. I was already irritated and extremely tired, (no excuse for that behavior) I must admit it was a bit overboard.

SS and I have, as stated clashed before.

The difference between the 2 clashes is that SS and I were both open minded about it and and both realized that the others points were still valid concerns.

Being open minded about it is something you chose to ignore.

I invite you to re-read my posts and tell me where I agrued that a 500W would NOT do the job. I did in fact agreed with you there.

I am merely suggesting a way for one to have a little extra safety against an aging PSU, to help ensure safe power as the aging occurs.

I have learned from not only employment experience and talking to electrical engineers in my family, but from personal experience having lost a VGA card AND mainboard at the same time. 5 yrs ago I had an Antec 420W 19A PSU pushing a config of AMD 3200+ single core, nVidia 6200, 2G Ram, 2 HDDs in RAID 0, 1 Optical drive, and 4 fans. Nothing fancy and 19A was plenty to do the job for a while. 2 years later I suddenly started having video problems and BSODs, tested the system to find the VGA card and mainboard had indeed been damaged due to the PSU losing output. The PSU was only pushing about 14A at peak. Thus I had to replace half my system.

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Power supply-Graphics Card compatibility

This is why less and less people are getting into PC gaming!