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AngryZealot
AngryZealot
Join Date 04/2008
+23

A better economy system

April 27, 2009 4:43:04 PM from Demigod ForumsDemigod Forums

This is my suggestion for fixing the slippery slope gameplay problem with regards to gold. In my opinion, it adds more depth to the game and solves several other problems at once. The numbers I suggest are all placeholders.

First, get rid of everything about the current economy except the goldmines.

Demigods give a baseline of 20 gold per level per kill. Killing a level 1 demigod nets you a baseline of 20 gold, while killing a level 20 demigod nets you a baseline of 400 gold. Yes, this is ridiculously low for a reason. Read on.

Readjustment of creep values:
- 5 gold per minotaur and archer
- 20 gold per priest
- 50 gold per catapult
- 100 gold per giant

Now the unique part: Each demigod has a bounty they obtain by doing "good things". Your bounty starts at 0. Killing creeps increases your bounty by (creep gold value)/2 (with minotaurs and archers rounded down to 2). Capturing a flag increases your bounty by 50. Killing a tower increases your bounty by 100. Killing a fortress increases your bounty by 500.

When you kill an enemy demigod, you get the baseline gold plus the bounty. The enemy demigod's bounty is reset to 0, unless they die to the creeps (to prevent suiciding to clear bounties). Your bounty increases by half the enemy's bounty at the time he or she was killed.

This accomplishes two important things:
- Players that contribute more to the game are worth more to kill. This is a totally obvious mechanism currently missing from the game. Corrollary: The AI or really bad players will contribute hardly anything to the opposing team.
- There is now a rebound mechanism.

How the rebound mechanism works:
- Suppose you and I both have a bounty of 1000 at level 10. I kill you and get 1200 gold. My bounty is now 1500 and your bounty is 0. If you kill me back, you get 1700 gold and your bounty is worth 750. If you kill me again when my bounty is low, you only get 200 or so gold, but if I kill you again, I get 950 gold. In other words, the team that comes from behind will tend to get more gold than the team in the lead. This places a stabilizing equilibrium onto the gold income, which propagates to items and citadel upgrades.

Thoughts?

demigod
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AngryZealot
Renevent
Join Date 04/2009
+4
Reply #1 April 27, 2009 4:50:45 PM
from Demigod ForumsDemigod Forums

I think the system currently in place works well enough that a total overhall like this is not needed.

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AngryZealot
Kitkun
Join Date 06/2008
+175
Reply #2 April 27, 2009 5:09:08 PM
from Demigod ForumsDemigod Forums

A good suggestion, I think. Although I'm also not sure it needs that big of an overhaul yet. Maybe later...

 

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AngryZealot
OMG_ZEX
Join Date 08/2008
+30
Reply #3 April 27, 2009 5:17:38 PM
from Demigod ForumsDemigod Forums

right now there is almost no depth to getting gold. Mines and the citadel upgrades really don't help much

this idea would make killing the best players on the team a top priority. I like this idea. Heres some Karma

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AngryZealot
lambdaman
Join Date 04/2006
+14
Reply #4 April 27, 2009 9:27:30 PM
from Demigod ForumsDemigod Forums

I think this would be an interesting system.  It would also be a totally different game.  I'm not sure if I'd want to replace the current game with that one, but it could be a pretty cool mod once modding works (and I bet not too difficult).

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AngryZealot
Teseer
Join Date 02/2008
+60
Reply #5 April 27, 2009 9:43:44 PM
from Demigod ForumsDemigod Forums

I do like the bounty idea. Would totally kill the issue with people who feed them. If the default without doing anything good is like 150, then someone who rushes to their death hundreds of times wouldnt be much of an issue.

I really like that idea.

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AngryZealot
Steel-Blade
Join Date 04/2009
0
Reply #6 April 28, 2009 8:28:52 AM
from Demigod ForumsDemigod Forums

Sounds decent, i like it. It might need a small adjustment but the idea is solid.

Now, how to you get the devs see it and maybe reply on this matter?

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AngryZealot
Levelheaded
Join Date 12/2007
+7
Reply #7 April 28, 2009 9:39:12 AM
from Stardock ForumsStardock Forums

Actualy, its a good idea.

Although id raise the baseline gold to at least a triple digit at level 1

 

 

do not forget that killing a demigod in itself needs to be worth the effort.

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AngryZealot
DroopyTheDog
Join Date 08/2008
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Reply #8 April 28, 2009 10:49:50 AM
from Demigod ForumsDemigod Forums

No comment on the actual values chosen, those will probably need a bit of hard testing to get right.

 

But I do like the bounty idea as a concept, it would make "farming" the AI or less experienced players less viable and the tougher players real prime targets.

 

It would do wonders for the complaints about feeders loosing the game from the more unsporting people too.

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AngryZealot
Sinzer
Join Date 09/2007
+9
Reply #9 April 28, 2009 12:26:52 PM
from Demigod ForumsDemigod Forums

The only problem is, that it delays the feeding and discourages early combat. No one will aim to take out a DG early game whatsoever.

You will be happy letting them get fat on creeps, before you even consider attacking them.

Also, I am not sure that allowing players some kind of catch-up mechanism in this game like this will really work. You should be able to turn around through skillful playing, not because someone is ganking a player and then gets killed once and releases a load of goodies.

The high cost of dieing, really has an effect on new players, that they learn not to die, certainly that is my experience after about 10 games or so. I think the main problem is that the game takes a long time to roll over a bad or slightly worse team.

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AngryZealot
DraxisOfWerner
Join Date 10/2007
0
Reply #10 April 28, 2009 1:44:51 PM
from Demigod ForumsDemigod Forums

I quite like the system the way it is, although I can see a very clear benefit for giving gold for DG kills based on something other than level, to stop the DG farming being such a massive win.  Players and AIs that die constantly would barely give any reward to the killer, but the hard-to-kill kind would net you a shiny new Godplate.

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AngryZealot
Jinx
Join Date 02/2008
+18
Reply #11 May 13, 2009 5:09:07 PM
from Demigod ForumsDemigod Forums

I like this system.  Right now, the momentum gained from killing another Demigod is too much.

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AngryZealot
Resist_The_Dawn
Join Date 03/2009
+3
Reply #12 May 13, 2009 5:49:49 PM
from Demigod ForumsDemigod Forums

This is a really good idea! Would add a lot of depth and get rid of the feeding and momentum problems I think. Lets hope a member of stardock or GPG sees this.

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AngryZealot
WickedDemiurge
Join Date 03/2009
+3
Reply #13 May 13, 2009 5:55:30 PM
from Demigod ForumsDemigod Forums

I don't necessarily agree with your specific numbers, but the base idea is very solid. It makes one feeder not a near automatic game loss and encourages pressure on someone who is doing really well which will help challenge them.

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AngryZealot
InfiniteVengeance
Join Date 04/2009
+28
Reply #14 May 13, 2009 5:57:18 PM
from Demigod ForumsDemigod Forums

Personally I think they need to significantly raise the amount of gold you get for killing creeps as there's little point to doing it now as you get nearly nothing and you get exp anyways by being in the general vicinity.

You get far too much gold by sitting there and doing nothing.  Enemy hero kills also give a bit too much gold in my opinion. (A few kills and they have an insurmountable item advantage usually)

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AngryZealot
Sakhari
Join Date 03/2006
+6
Reply #15 May 13, 2009 6:01:31 PM
from Stardock ForumsStardock Forums

Cursory glance tells me that I like it.  I'm not a fan of the way the economy works at the moment and this strikes me as a step in the right direction.

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AngryZealot
JagerJack
Join Date 04/2009
+26
Reply #16 May 13, 2009 6:12:26 PM
from Demigod ForumsDemigod Forums

I think this is too large of an overhaul for normal gameplay, but it would be a very interesting game type that I would love to play.

karma for creativity.

EDIT: I do, however, agree that the gold system could use a few changes.

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AngryZealot
Jinx
Join Date 02/2008
+18
Reply #17 May 13, 2009 6:19:45 PM
from Demigod ForumsDemigod Forums

One thing though, they more or less said they don't want last hits in the game.  If they give creeps a higher bounty, the concept of "last hits" will automatically be introduced, unless players share creep gold.  Personally i LOVE last hits and it's one thing that made DoTA so challenging.

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AngryZealot
StAcK3D_ActR
Join Date 11/2008
+24
Reply #18 May 13, 2009 6:25:40 PM
from Demigod ForumsDemigod Forums

Killing creeps increases your bounty by (creep gold value)/2 (with minotaurs and archers rounded down to 2). Capturing a flag increases your bounty by 50. Killing a tower increases your bounty by 100. Killing a fortress increases your bounty by 500.

this reminds me of last hitting in dota, i think i read somewhere that frogboy didnt want that implemented(not so sure)

plus what happens when several players capture a flag, will the bounty be split?

and killing towers and fortresses, if you assist someone in killing them do you get a bounty? or is it only the person with the last hit that gets the bonus?

or are you saying that you dont get gold for them at all, just the opposing team when you get killed?

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AngryZealot
si1foo
Join Date 11/2008
+6
Reply #19 May 29, 2009 5:05:56 PM
from Demigod ForumsDemigod Forums

this would make tb a money whore

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AngryZealot
regabond
Join Date 04/2009
+4
Reply #20 May 29, 2009 5:23:07 PM
from Demigod ForumsDemigod Forums

I think this would be worth testing out through a mod in the future.

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AngryZealot
AntiCommie
Join Date 02/2008
0
Reply #21 May 29, 2009 5:29:16 PM
from Demigod ForumsDemigod Forums

I like this idea too.  It would also probably help with ragequitting, since as a noob I made many team mates quit.  As a veteran now, I understand their pain and can see the downfall a constantly dying team mate can cause.  Anything to help mitigate this would make it more noob friendly, and encourage teamwork, instead of quitting and beating on noobs.

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AngryZealot
BigAbboTT
Join Date 01/2009
+8
Reply #22 May 29, 2009 5:34:01 PM
from Demigod ForumsDemigod Forums

Quoting JagerJack,
reply 16
I think this is too large of an overhaul for normal gameplay, but it would be a very interesting game type that I would love to play.

This!

"Headhunter" mode. It's like Slaughter, but fun.

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AngryZealot
Covenn
Join Date 04/2009
+1
Reply #23 May 29, 2009 5:41:42 PM
from Demigod ForumsDemigod Forums

You would really screw over gods who lack the ability to AOE kill minions, would take them a lot longer to earn gold and gear up, which would cause them to be farmed, and kept out of the lanes to grind minions.

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AngryZealot
si1foo
Join Date 11/2008
+6
Reply #24 May 30, 2009 3:48:29 PM
from Demigod ForumsDemigod Forums

Quoting Covenn,
reply 23
You would really screw over gods who lack the ability to AOE kill minions, would take them a lot longer to earn gold and gear up, which would cause them to be farmed, and kept out of the lanes to grind minions.

in simple terms a good but bad idea

 

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AngryZealot
Wexmajor
Join Date 11/2007
+2
Reply #25 May 30, 2009 5:44:32 PM
from Demigod ForumsDemigod Forums

which would cause them to be farmed

 

Half the point of the idea is to eliminate farming.

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