please remove the impulse requirement for patches, requireing it really does not make any sense...

I would really like to hear stardocks reason for this change.

from Sins Forums

I know it's in bad taste to make your first post a bad one, but I really feel strongly against this impulse requirement.

 

I bought this game largely because of stardocks reputation as an customer friendly company. (Read: No retarded DRM policies) So needles to say I was quite agitated that I needed to download a program in order to download the patch.

 

Now I realise the first thing someone is going to remind me of is that impulse is not an DRM at all. I'm quite aware of that, but it feels and acts just like one. And that I just can't stand.

 

I'm a firm believer in that the biggest reason why PC games are not selling as much as consoles these days is this whole bizarre DRM nonsense publishers keep coming up with that actually feels like punishment to customers that buy their products.

 

I feel stardock isn't nearly there yet, but I think the impulse requirement is a step in the direction of continuing this DRM death spiral that PC gaming is now known for.

 

Now with this said, I have decided that for as long as I have to have impulse installed on my computer to patch sins of a solar empire I'm not going to buy any expansion packs nor any more stardock games. I know I'm only one person and probably won't make that big of impact on your books, but I hope others that feel the same way follow suit.

 

Hence lessoning PC sales even more... But really what other way can us consumers do to convince publishers to just stop the BS, and just let us patch up and play the game we bought?

18,463 views 22 replies
Reply #1 from Sins Forums Top

Easy answer: Piracy.  Just look at Demigod day 1.  18000 legitimate users, 100000 pirates.  Want to know what's killing PC gaming?  There's your answer.  Requiring authentication for patches and updates is going to be the way of the future, if it isn't already there, with most games going through Steam, Impulse or their own system (ie Battle.net) and I have no problem with this.  You don't need to log into Impulse to play, what's so hard about downloading Impulse and running it once a month for updates?  If you want to boycott any game that makes you register or authenticate in some way to get updates...well that's it for gaming for you.  Even the consoles are going this way now.  Don't think Blizzard won't be doing this for Starcraft 2 and Diablo 3.

Reply #2 from Stardock Forums Top

Err. Actualy stardock said that impulse and the distribution of patches via impulse is their way of drm. And compared to what others companys did and still do, i say its an acceptable way.

As long as they do not force me to have impulse running at any other time but ME wanting to CHECK up for patches or interesting games....

Multiplicity - Control multiple PCs using one keyboard and mouse
Reply #3 from Sins Forums Top

Why people complain about Impulse... Sure that you have a Microsoft OS who use a online check too... if you have not a valid installation, no update...

 

By the way, with the recent boxed version, Impulse is installed in the same time that the game... Impulse is in some way part of the game...

 

In the past, i have make my share of complain about Impulse... the software was more that buggy... but now, it work good... only one complain is that it don't yet work on my Linux system ( Sins work and Stardock central was working )...

Reply #4 from Sins Forums Top

In the past, i have make my share of complain about Impulse... the software was more that buggy... but now, it work good... only one complain is that it don't yet work on my Linux system ( Sins work and Stardock central was working )...
End of quote

Well, I'll be.  I wasn't expecting Wine to handle it,  but it was actually able to load Entrenchment.  Freaky.

 

As for DRM and PC games, I'd place more blame for the decline in PC games sales for

- Game consoles are increasingly common... and even a PS3 or a Wii with all the gizmos is cheaper and *far* simpler than high-end gaming machines.

- It can be somewhat harder to rip off console games than PC games, e.g. needing hardware modifications to the console.

 

Reply #5 from Sins Forums Top

Thing is DRM isn't the problem. DRM as a phrase is completely demonised by the gaming media, but err whats wron with the protection of your product? As long as society is structured in its current state people will have the right to make money from their own ideas. I understand that this wasnt an issue in the 90's(im guessing) due to less internet access probably less piracy., though I remember the days when you didnt even need a cd in the drive :grin:

The problem with DRM arrives when you leave it to EA or microsoft and they give you a game you can only install 3 times, or installs software that rapes your computer. Stardock and Steam don't do that, so why begrudge  the game designers  their owed money by complaining agains trelatively unintrusive protection? TBH this seems like less effort to do than searching fot the CD+ as an owner of 2 computer in 2 cities downloading anywhere anytime is usefull functionality for me.

 

Lol and PC gamings been 'dying' since about 1993, or perhaps it just isn't and markets don't understand the resillience of us geeks.

Reply #6 from Sins Forums Top

Lol and PC gamings been 'dying' since about 1993, or perhaps it just isn't and markets don't understand the resillience of us geeks.
End of quote

PC Gaming will die when Hell freezes over or Duke Nukem Whenever comes out.  Whichever comes first.  Either of them is a sure sign of the Apocalypse. ;)

Reply #7 from Sins Forums Top

I am fine with impulse but quite suspicious about the goo system.

The thing i don't like about impulse is the agressive advertisment campaign it brings with him.You can have a system that allow only regular customers to make the updates with a software included in Sins : you click on the update button in the menu, create an account, log in and then the game download and install the update by itself, without having to run an other programm like impulse. Example : Rise Of Nations.

They could have done it but it wouldn't have promoted Impulse so they made impulse a must have. And now you discover that you can buy MyColors, Galactic civilizations and so on...

It is not really DRM, it is more about advertising you, wanting it or not.

Reply #8 from Sins Forums Top

Yawn. This has been gone over a million times. It is in the T&Cs (manual) that Impulse is how patching is done. It allows Stardock to patch all their programs (not just Sins) using a common method. It also allows digital sales and authentication for getting patches.

Build a bridge and get over it. It won't change and you are just cheating yourself by not getting Entrenchment...

Reply #9 from Sins Forums Top

I don't understand why people complain about Impulse. It compresses downloads and automatically extracts them. Its great.

 

you are just cheating yourself by not getting Entrenchment...
End of quote

Vey true.

Reply #10 from Sins Forums Top

Impulse is a patching service. There is no patch per se. Impulse does a compare, downloads what it needs to, and does delta-patching (iirc). This is cheaper easier and faster than the standalone patch method, and requires less bandwidth to boot. That's especially the case when patching boxed versions of games. Company of Heroes, for example, requires like 6-7 seperate patches for the retail version to get up to date and that's with several omnibus patches. 

You do not need Impulse to run the game. You can install patches then uninstall impulse and the game will run fine.

 

Reply #11 from Sins Forums Top

Deal with it!

Reply #12 from Sins Forums Top

Quoting Levelheaded, reply 2
Err. Actualy stardock said that impulse and the distribution of patches via impulse is their way of drm. And compared to what others companys did and still do, i say its an acceptable way.

As long as they do not force me to have impulse running at any other time but ME wanting to CHECK up for patches or interesting games....
End of Levelheaded's quote

 

I agree.  I don't have a problem with Impulse as a means of DRM along with requiring people to have a valid key for online multiplayer.  I'd much, much rather have that than other forms of nasty, intrusive DRM. Also, the initial release is, in essence, almost like a Demo for the game.  By letting people pirate that, they encourage some to buy the game itself so they can update it or play it in online multiplayer (where the competitive players play).

Reply #13 from Sins Forums Top

Quoting CenturionJixra, reply 12

I agree.  I don't have a problem with Impulse as a means of DRM along with requiring people to have a valid key for online multiplayer.  I'd much, much rather have that than other forms of nasty, intrusive DRM. Also, the initial release is, in essence, almost like a Demo for the game.  By letting people pirate that, they encourage some to buy the game itself so they can update it or play it in online multiplayer (where the competitive players play).
End of CenturionJixra's quote

Lol that is what I did.

Reply #14 from Sins Forums Top

Also, just in case the OP missed it - Impulse allows you to take an archive of a version of the a program, so you can re-install it at that version later.

Just note that the archive is OS specific unless you do certain options which I won't go into here - go learn about Impulse if you are that interested (I figure you aren't as you hate it, so I won't waste my time explaining in more detail)

Reply #15 from Sins Forums Top
Now I realise the first thing someone is going to remind me of is that impulse is not an DRM at all. I'm quite aware of that, but it feels and acts just like one. And that I just can't stand.
End of quote
I would agree with you if Impulse wasn't a value-added service, but it stays on my machine because it offers things that have nothing to do with DRM. For example, I can install the latest fully-patched SOASE in about a third of the time that it takes me to install it from CD.
But it's also worth mentioning that you only need Impulse to get the files, you can uninstall it and activate via e-mail if you really want to. Since Impulse doesn't control your access to the game (it can't revoke you), I'm not sure why it feels like a DRM platform.
I'm a firm believer in that the biggest reason why PC games are not selling as much as consoles these days is this whole bizarre DRM nonsense publishers keep coming up with that actually feels like punishment to customers that buy their products.

I feel stardock isn't nearly there yet, but I think the impulse requirement is a step in the direction of continuing this DRM death spiral that PC gaming is now known for.
End of quote
I think the death spiral has very specific causes, namely: 1) Malware CD-checking software like SecuROM, and 2) The stupid assertion that a software license that is not perpetual is still somehow worth the same amount. I don't see Impulse as a move towards either of these ideas, so I don't think of it a step in the wrong direction (yet).
Now with this said, I have decided that for as long as I have to have impulse installed on my computer to patch sins of a solar empire I'm not going to buy any expansion packs nor any more stardock games. I know I'm only one person and probably won't make that big of impact on your books, but I hope others that feel the same way follow suit.

Hence lessoning PC sales even more... But really what other way can us consumers do to convince publishers to just stop the BS, and just let us patch up and play the game we bought?
End of quote
If you really want to make a statement, pirate the game and mail the development studio a check for $100. That should get the publisher's attention.

Reply #16 from Sins Forums Top

If you really want to make a statement, pirate the game and mail the development studio a check for $100. That should get the publisher's attention.
End of quote

:thumbsup:

Reply #17 from Sins Forums Top

I liken Impulse to the Blizzard Updater from Warcraft 3 and before. Unintrusive, simple purpose program. Sure it has some added features that help the companies as well as the customers, but essentially its the same thing. I only use it when I need a patch or when I wanted to purchase Entrenchment.

Reply #18 from Stardock Forums Top

The more people complain about useful programs like Impulse to closer we get to having that kind of luxury taken away.

Sooner or later companies like Stardock will get tired of all the whining, get tired of all the piracy, and insist users log on to the server to access the game.

That would bring an end to piracy once and for all. I'm all for it.

Reply #19 from Sins Forums Top

Basically its Impulse or DRM, take your pick.  Stardock need some way of seperating legit customers from the pirates, and this is the best and most consumer-friendly way of doing it.

Reply #20 from Sins Forums Top

Oh, come on: Impulse is hardly worth complaining about. You can play the game without having to go online or anything. You only need it for updates. Stardock is very lenient and (though they say it is illegal in the EULA) you can even install the game at a friend's place and let him play singleplayer for free. If Stardock would be any more lenient, people would start taking advantage of that.

Compare them to EA with their stupid DRM on RA3 -_-'. How hard did people have to complain on the RA3 boards against the DRM and all they got was a deauthorization tool and 2 extra installs. (For the people who aren't into this: EA initially proposed to give RA3 an installation limit of 3 with no way to deauthorize a machine). Really, you can't expect Stardock to be much more customer friendly then they are now.

Reply #21 from Sins Forums Top

I personally didnt have any problems playing this game until I tried to update and had to download Impulse. Since I've done that I cannot get in the game at all. I get a " Could not run SDActivate.exe Try running as Admin" error. I really dont see why they had to require Impulse, it totally destroyed the game for me. I cannot even start it, with or without Impulse running.

Reply #22 from Sins Forums Top

I personally didnt have any problems playing this game until I tried to update and had to download Impulse. Since I've done that I cannot get in the game at all. I get a " Could not run SDActivate.exe Try running as Admin" error. I really dont see why they had to require Impulse, it totally destroyed the game for me. I cannot even start it, with or without Impulse running.
End of quote

Contact Sales and get your money back....it's Stardock, they'll give it back to you.