TEC starts for multiplayer

I'm interested in seeing some discussion on starts for the TEC.

Up until recently, I liked using a 2 cap start (akkan then marza, or if I'm feeling frisky, 2 marzas), followed

by LRM spam.  Once I see what my opponent has, I'll adapt accordingly.

 

However, some think that 2 caps is risky, and loses to straight lrm spam.  I've tried straight LRM, but as TEC, I dont feel

like I get the bang for my buck....

 

Other options I've tried is going for carriers, but it's too hard to get enough  carriers before being attacked...doesnt seem viable without a serious feed, even then carriers produce so slow that it seems unrealistic to be able to use them in sufficient numbers.

Same idea with massing heavy carriers and 5 military labs.

 

Those are straight military starts.  How about economic starts?  or variations of mil/eco starts?

 

RM

6,460 views 17 replies
Reply #1 Top

Akkan and Marza are always solid first capital ships for TEC. Sova is also extremely useful when on the defense or for countering the common Vasari players early-game.

I don't recommend building two capital ships before the LRMs. That already sucks 4200 credits and a lot of metal and crystal, for two ships. Build just your first capital ship, than try to concentrate on bringing out your LRMs and later Carriers. If you have gotten some higher logistic planets, build Trade Ports to bring out the Carriers faster.

With the LRMs, TEC has to build about double the number to be effective. Of course, they're already affordable and later get Cluster Warhead, so try bringing them out ASAP.

Reply #2 Top

One problem with LRMs currently, is that their counter (carriers) are the main componenet of most fleets. This is not to say that you should avoid LRMs, it's just a factor you need to consider.

TEC, contrary to most people's instincts, don't have many good "eco starts" in a multiplayer situation (unless you're in the pocket, but then everyone's strat is the same - don't build a real fleet, just keep capturing planets and feeding the front players). If you're on a front, you need to be fortifying choke points, which is expensive, and you just don't have the extra resources to spend on trade and, arguably less importantly, culture (without some serious feed).

Reply #3 Top

If you wanted a good economic start, build two  civic researches, one on home planet at first, and the second on your first asteroid.  You can get your trade ports, then, while other races take 3 or 4 trade economic buildings.  TEC  gets a head start when it comes to funds

Reply #4 Top

You should have at least three military labs before you consider a second capital ship.  As great as caps are, especially if you level them up early on, you're just leaving yourself vulnerable.  If I put money into carriers that you put into a second capital ship, I can mince your LRF and leave your capital ships very vulnerable to my LRF.  Typically you want to have a well rounded fleet that can't be easily countered before you get extra capital ships.

As mentioned, TEC doesn't have very many economic opening options.  This is because if you put money into trade ports and get rushed, you have no chance of survival.  If I send a scout (and I will) and see two civic research labs, I'm going to hit with everything I have and it's very unlikely you will live.  As a result, unless you're defended by allies, you should always lead with two military labs.  Upgrading your planet with population infrastructure is still reasonable, but investing in civic labs is too expensive and leaves you too vulnerable.

Reply #5 Top

good points.

So essentially, 1 cap and 20-30 LRMs are needed just to survive on a wing.  Then begin with carriers when viable?

 

Interestingly, I've watched a number of REALLY good players open with 2 caps....this being one of the reasons that I started using this strategy.  Alternatively, I've created an akkan with about 3-5 LRMs to begin colonizing the middle of the map, while my 2nd cap (a marza) along with my nonstop LRM creation play defense.  This puts me on defense early, however, with some repair stations I can hold out while the economy grows, thanks to the ongoing colonizing being done by the akkan and the LRMs up the middle (and these asteroids/planets generally stay mine into the mid game when the middle map gets more populated by each of the players.

This isnt always going to work, as a hard rush hurts bad and is difficult to defend like the advent lrm spam....

Reply #6 Top

Remember with 2 caps, you 1/2 the amount of exp they get for each ship you kill if they are in the same grav well. This can slow doen the time it takes to get MB on the Marza.

I have seen MP games with 2 TEC fleets fighting - one has two marzas at lvl 5, the other has a lvl 7 or 8 and is able to fire off MB and survive while the 2 lower levels ones keep having to retreat to repair...

Reply #7 Top

wow...I had NOT considered that! 

Queestion:

Experience in a gravity well is divided by all the caps in that well, and no other ships, right?  IOW, if I have 5 HCs and a cap, the experience is not divided 6 ways....right?

Reply #8 Top

Yeah, that's right. Other ships don't suck up experience.

And anyway: if you go dual cap + LRM spam, you expose yourself to carrier spam, which is a very solid strat anyway. So be aware of your weakness if you do this. At the very least, I'd back the LRMs up with flak. That's the same lvl of tech, so they fit together quite nicely. Also, flaks are decent if he also throws LRM against you (something that is unwise against an LRM spammer, but it might happen).

Reply #9 Top

I've been getting lvl 6 marza's much faster now....Keeping that 2nd cap out of the mix for the first part of the game makes A LOT of difference.

 

Question:  How important are hoshikos?  What do they do besides healing and/or using their destruco-bots?

Reply #10 Top

Hoshikos are, IMO, the best unit in the game. They don't do anything except heal and bot, but those 2 things alone make them a force to be reckoned with. Don't make a whole fleet of them, but putting a healthy number in any fleet is a great move.

Reply #11 Top

Readyman

Hohos are great - they repair, can disable enemy weapons AND can do damage of their own (limited amount, but it adds up).

However you DO need to mix them into a balanced fleet and get the upgrades to complement them such as health and armor to make their restoration more effective and laser upgrades to increase the damage they do...

Catch you in the lobby...

Reply #12 Top

One thing that is VITAL for TEC is to send your colony ships after the neutral mines.  The vasari tend to take these over early on, but a colony ship with 3 lt. frigs will hold most neutral gravity wells.  The anti matter regenerates SO slowly that it almost doesnt pay to move the colony on (unless there are neutrals 1 jump away).  Leaving a colony ship in the area along with 3-4 lt. frigs in each grav. well (depending on how many mines are there to defend), makes for a very strong opening.

This fascilitates a stronger rush, and opens up options for a heavy rush (lrms/carriers with lrms/HCs & flak) while building your economy (building one civ lab, and getting all the lvl 1 techs isnt that expensive, but hugely effects your long term game)....and with a few neutrals, you can do this while producing fleet non stop.  I've even done this while producing carriers nonstop from 2 factories.

 

Of course this depends quite a bit on the map layout, and poor planet distribution messes things up horribly.  However, it's an option.....

 

Also not to be avoided (much) is the TEC scout spam  :)  (thanks bordy!)

 

hope this helps someone.

 

RM

Reply #13 Top

Something I do occasionally is to actually set up two colonizing fronts, one with cap ship+4-5 frigs, the other with 10-12 frigs and colonizing frig. This booms both econ and miliary.

Reply #14 Top

Here's an interesting one:

Quick Start/ large fleet sizes-

Start off build 1 sova, 1 colonizer & 1 military lab. Sell 200 metal and buy 100 crystal. Research Cap Ship fleet logistics upgrade. Send Sova & colony to colonize nearest asteroid. Purchase sova #2. Sink point in both sovas in embargo. Upgrade asteroid logistics and build extractors. Send sovas to nearest enemy HW (3-4 jumps MAX)set one to autocast and the other leave autocast off. When they jump in the well, wait until the first embargo ability cooldown is half way, then active the second sovas and turn it on autocast. Set both to cirlce the well if nemies are present. Upgrade HW logistic and build 2 more military labs & a frigate factory. Research timed explosives & LRMs. Start building scouts set their build waypoint to the nearest safe gravity well to enemy hw. Micromanage sovas to keep them alive then send in a massive fleet of scouts (30+) to destroy all enemy buildings in the well and then start targeting enemy lrfs, start mixing in lrms with your fleet to take out what left of his. This works well against stranded opponents in large team games. Requires a decent amount of micro management skill however.

Reply #15 Top

Wow!  interesting strats!

@ Flameburn:  I like this idea...it's kind of a variation on the akkan first, then marza/lrm strat.  Akkan and a few lt. frigs move up the middle, marza and lrms move slowly toward enemy, with a focus on defense, since the enemy will have gotten a jump on you with resources, since he only went with one cap.

 

@ Deceiver:  Nice Strat!  I like it  :)  Very interesting and fun.

Reply #16 Top

One of my personal fav tech starts:

build cap factory (que marza)

crystal ext

2-3 scouts +2 LFs +colony frig (send the colony and LFs to 1st asteroid)

civic lab

2 metal ext

(scuttle cap factory after 1st cap)

send marza to meatier planet (desert/terran) the LFs and colony can handle the first asteroid atleast

(do research 1 point for terran pop upgrade and 2 points for cheaper extractors)

build 2 mil labs

(research repair bay and LRM)

BUILD LOTS OF LRM then 1 more lab and get hoshis

...

 

Reply #17 Top

My personal one.. Perhaps not the most effective, but I rely more heavily on economy than many others do...(This is also only used on larger maps)

Max homeworld population and build four cobalts and send them to the nearby asteroid to kill the light resistance there.  Follow them with a protev (I don't ever use akkans...) and colonize it.  Back on your home world, build a cap factory and pump out a Kol/Marza (depends on my mood and how far away the enemy is.  Kols are for smaller maps and Marzas are for the larger ones because I often find that I only get a marza to lvl5 on the smaller ones and I don't like them much until MB) which is then used in conjunction with the four cobalts I have to push towards the one with krosovs, cobalts, and flaks.  All the while, I am building a couple civic stations to get trade going.  Then, I build two military labs and research lrms.  While researching, I build more Cobalts and que two lrms.  The four or so cobalts get sent to the front line to act as an alert force as my scouts are busy running around and the lrms get sent to the cap to join the fleet.  By now, the moderately protected world (usually desert) has been defeated and I call the protev in which is just one jump behind the fleet while the rest of the ships move out.  From there, it really depends on the map...