Sins Forums
So, now that the Diplomacy Beta is over, do you think that all or most of the online regulars will move to Diplomacy? Does it really improve the online game?
I can't imagine playing without it. The pacing options alone make it a critical upgrade for MP.
OK Frogboy, now that I have your ear....at some point will there be an attempt to fix two glaring and rather annoying issues with the game?
(1.) Both regular Sins and Entrenchment (and presumably Diplomacy) access the exact same file, uimappings.setting to load keybinds, but each one uses a different version of the file and they overwrite the file with a default copy if you saved settings to the file from a different version of the game. Will this ever be fixed so that they use their own individual uimappings.setting files?
I get around this by having two separate keybind files set to Read Only (and a backup for each) whose file names I change depending on which version of Sins I want to play. I have a shortcut to the Settings folder on my desktop but it's still a pain.
(2.) In online multiplayer you cannot see available games for other versions of the game. I understand that an Entrenchment player would need to load Regular Sins if he wanted to play a Regular Sins game, but wouldn't it be nice if he could see what games were available for Regular Sins while being on Entrenchment before deciding to open Regular Sins? This is only going to make it tougher for Diplomacy players who would be willing to play games in Entrenchment or Regular Sins. Could you please create a checkbox option for each version of the game to allow players to click a checkbox to toggle which games they can see in their Join Games menu? For example, the Join Games window (where you see games that people are hosting) could include three checkboxes that could be checked on or off in any combination as long as one was always on: "See Sins games." "See Entrenchment games." "See Diplomacy games."
Right now I keep both Regular Sins and Entrenchment open and log on and off, back and forth between the two, to see what games are available, closing the game and reopening it after swapping over the right uimappings.setting file if need be. I don't know if my computer can handle having three instances of the game open at one time--Regular, Entrenchment, and Diplomacy so that I can toggle logging on/off between them to check the game activity.
I'm also still hoping that custom map auto-download will be enabled one day but that's not really a Diplomacy-specific issue.
1) is fixed. Diplomacy uses separate settings files.
Your second wish isn't in the release build of Diplo.
As for the OP, while a lot of things in Diplo are more geared towards single player, we (we being the testers) fought pretty hard for making envoys and pacts easily accessible in MP. They do require civvy labs, but the initial envoy cruiser research is tier1, and their abilities are low-tier as well with the ships themselves being very cheap to make. Pacts need more labs but most pacts are quite handy to have, especially when combined with the side effect of envoy abilities.
Some pacts/envoy abilities are less useful in MP than SP, however there's stuff to like, I believe.
Thank you for the info, Annatar. As far as I can tell, Regular Sins and Entrenchment are still using the same file name, but I'm happy to hear that at least Diplomacy will get its own keybinds settings file.
Actually, that's one reason I'm hoping MP *doesn't* pick up diplomacy. Games already fly too fast for me to be able to put forth my best effort. Any faster and I guess I simply won't be able to play at all 
YES!YES!YES! DT BEWARE, YOU WONT BE FEEDED THE NEXT TIME YOU ARE NEXT TO THE GREAT ONE!DEPLOMACY YOU HAVE TO RESEARCH FEED! MUHAHAHAHAHHAHA
Cause if you cant smell what the Hawk is cooking, the Hawk is probably cooking you
PS. Capital ships, and other units pathing needs to be sorted, getting stuck by an asteriod or planet, isnt cool, and isnt realistic.
I see great shadow that covers the sins comunity and put us all in fear.
Its Sunny's ego 
Somehaw im not very exited about diplo. but we will see...
PS Frogboy nice advertisement but real usefull new MP features would do it much better.
Lack of new ideas?-read foum
Pirates are awesome now, I don't see why people would turn them off now. About an hour into a FFA test game they attacked where I had a Kol and 24 LRMs waiting. I got owned. Definitely not just free XP anymore.
Obgsloan its definitly great single player expansion but i fail to see what it can offer me when i dont play sp and ffa at all.
If it contain some sweet ideas like lv10cap can be turned into supercap or implement cap ship only mod into a game or....
but al i hear is a culture cursier that seem expensive and useless in most situations and need to reserch feed whith makes game more dependent on personal skill then teamplay.
I see the feed research as more of a team rush deterrent. If you're gonna rush, you better have some skill, cuz you're aren't gonna get that big feed to put you over the top super early. In all likelihood though, the eco spot will probably research feeding first, or at least second only to tradeports or culture centers. And as fast as I know people can get tradeports no matter what race they are, I don't think it will change the team dynamic a whole lot.
Quite the opposite. First, it's not a culture cruiser, second it's very cheap. It buffs your ally's planets, and though some buffs are more useful than others in an MP game, some are guite good: Vasari envoy increases resource gain at the planet by 100% - so double - for 60 seconds every 3 minutes, TEC envoy increases trade income, and can also make money for the owner of the envoy. Vasari envoy can also make a planet invulnerable to bombardment.
The Advent have worse Envoy abilities on their cruisers, but their pacts more than make up for it:
20% research speed boost and -10% cost.
+15% beam damage
+20% max antimatter and +20% regen
+2 strikecraft per squad (awesome for Vasari for obvious reasons)
+15% shields, +15% shield regen, +2% mitigation
i don't think that i will EVER be playing diplomacy on multiplayer. I bought the expansion, and i found Envoy cruisers if anything just a detriment to the game, and seriously, how uncreative, i could have swore when i played originally the tec envoy cruiser was an upside down starbase constructor.
i don't think asking people on ICO to switch to diplomacy for the option of a faster speed is worth it, it will only start lagging faster, and who knows, if we put ICO under more pressure, who knows what the minidump and desync gods will have in store for us??
lol, nightradier is right, the tec envoy crusior could have been more 'unique', maybe you could make the envoy crusior and tec starbase all in one?
So, how would a Diplomacy 5v5 work? Would you have to make sure that there is a player for each of the three races on the team and then have all 5 players have 1 Envoy cruiser from each race at their home terran so that all five can share the benefits? Would I need to make 4 Envoy Cruisers and send one to each ally?
I wonder what the effect would really be--if each team does the same thing, is the end result that everyone gets more income, faster extraction rates, and faster research? Would the practical result merely be no different than if the rates of income, extraction and research were speeded up for everyone in the game along with all ships doing more damage and having more armor?
It also seems like starting positions could play an even bigger role in games since one team could really get screwed over if it can't easily get its Envoy Cruisers out to everyone on the team.
I really don't think that team games in Mp are going to change that much. I think diplomacy will just give the pocket slot more to contribute. You won't have to build envoy cruisers, but the pocket spot will be given the opportunity to help out his team with envoy cruisers abilities, and pacts. Since he generally charges up the civics tree to get his economy rolling, he'll be able to research the diplomacy techs, and have access to all the bonuses there in. I don't think it will force the folks on the front lines to go civics just to get the diplomacy techs. Just like entrenchment techs, they aren't required to get to win (although they help a lot). I don't know exactly how MP is going to go in Diplomacy, but I think it will just give an eco player more options for helping out his team short of building a military. Starting positions play a pretty significant role in MP, and I'd imagine that they would play an a slightly larger role in diplomacy, but only because a player will have to tech some civics to be able to feed his allies, so teams or players might have to make harder decisions on whether or not to have a feeder if there isnt an obvious eco spot. It won't be a simple "ok Im winning over here, lemme send some of my extra resources to my ally who isnt doing so well". You'll have to spend a little time and money to be able to do that. Also I think AI taking over for desynced, minid, disc, or players who've left will become a little less detrimental (a little mind you) as an eco spot player will be able to have a bit more control over the Ai to get it to harass enemies (eventhough other players on the team will still be able to boss it around via the normal defend attack commands). It probably wont effect the gameplay as much as you think, or as much as entrenchment did. Thats my opinion on it anyways, but I guess we'll see.
im super disappointed... diplo contributes nothing but problems to MP. Ent was a great idea and grea addition to MP where as diplomacy in a set teams game does absolutely nothing. With ENT we got SBs, mines, and various other upgrades to help defend urself. It made the game expansive. With diplomacy, we get a new ship? that in a MP game wont do anything. I had a feeling this whole diplomacy expansion was gonna be a bad idea for MP.
MS
{SB}=>Specter
How can you say that? In teams games, diplomacy is huge because you can work to build up each side to support pacts which give your side HUGE advantages over the other.
The whole pacts part of Diplomacy was created for team games.
Just wait. Two hours in they will rickroll your fully upgraded starbase and all supporting tactical structures - nuke your planet, and then sit there forever making it a pain in the ass to get the world back. Take a look at their hp/armor values later in the game too... it's better than anything any faction can get.
^ That's good. Invincible pirates are not fun.
I think Diplomacy will bring a lot to MP. If you think of Entrenchment as the expansion for the militarily oriented player, consider Diplomacy the expansion for the civic minded players. It will bring great benefits to those who are already headed in that direction. It makes perfect sense really, just like Entrenchment; what use does a pocket player have for building a starbase, after all? If you don't benefit directly from the Diplomacy upgrades (like wing players) you don't have to research them. It's just like a pocket player; he has no use for a Starbase, but he's not going in that direction anyway, and so has no reason to reseach it, so it's not his problem. i.e. quit complaing about having to build civics on the front line, you won't. Leave the civics to the people building civic labs, and focus on the military stuff vital to your survival. Pocket players never complained about starbases, did they?
Eh, convoluted post. But yes, I support and hope we will see Diplomacy in MP.
Actually pocket players, especially Vasari, will put up starbases for teammates on their flanks and also try to starbase enemy planets. A pocket player might also move across the middle of the map eventually and open up a new front or be forced into combat if one his flanks dies.
All very true, but wouldnt it be nice to be able put those civics labs to more use in helping your friends? And some of those envoy ships abilities would be pretty saweet for the guys on the frontlines.
I disagree fully and I really like the fact that this expansion focuses on diplomacy. It makes the game so much richer.
A small idea: what about also counting having a sizeable fleet (e.g. at least one capital and 10 frigates) present at your allies capital system as a small bonus to relations if you keep them there for at least x minutes? It must be worth something to help defending your allies' planets, right?
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