My dear Lagfleet

I  think u have spend too much time with kok, or even he wrote it for u. Definitly its his level.

U can flame me  but u cant change the fact, confirmed by most skilled players,

It seems u r that kind of the person who  wont belive in truth even when that truth punch u in the face.

I did use extreme exaggerated arguments as my opponetns did. And yes i can relay on that 4v4 replay as argument in disscusion with Minds. Definitly has more vlaue then your pointless flaming. Wonder, y u hate me so much? Must have hit u  too many times with your favourite mines subs combo. Worked great for  spammers like u.

The problem with your, Greys,  mine, and many other people argument and point of view is we play only 1 race, or have 1 race as favourite , and want that race to be better.

Thats y we should listen to JJ and Cykur who plays all races and have most expirience.

So go and read everything if its not too hard for yout tiny little  spammer brain and then, add something constructive if u can.

PS, or better not, i already know what will u say: NERF vasari nerf subs nerf phase misilles nerf phase traps nerf scintra  boost javs's dmg, hp, speed and range.

advent just 2 halycon and spam tier 0 units.....i see the best advent players own with this all the time (ask greyfox)

going drones is really dumb lmao cause all he need is spam out some skirmishers (which are cheap and require no research)

as tec usualy akkan then LRM spam will catch skin spammer off gaurd and they will lose one or two before they knew what hit them (auqia does this all the time)

one thing i am very very tired of is average-below average players smurfing trying to sell themselves as skilled they skin spam and man they look so skilled the next game they get picked real high then...woa that guy actualy sucks at this game the skins are just masking his noobneesss

lol qu4r oh qu4r. where you get the idea that i prefer a sub mine combo i dont even know as i dont tend to play vasari because they have too many advantages. hell the only huge problem that i see with vasari really is that phase traps stop sc for too long. i have since learned that subs are counterable, although it requires huge investments to defeat it. as far as i saw, no one has asked for advent or TEC to be specifically improved, only general BALANCE put inplace. i know you dont want it to change because you thrive in unbalance and making people angry by exploiting that unbalance then saying its not there but it is. deny all you want it doesnt change facts. i dont know how you get your ideas that most people think sins is balanced because they dont. also, why do you think its always quar vs the world? hmmm...could it be that possibily you are wrong? no that can't be it. now qu4r i understand the only way you can think is how can i make this person angry but that does not help us get balance into the game. but there is one thing i must thank you for. by being ignorant and a huge troll you have almost single handely kept this thread alive meaning that devs might get attracted to it. now i have seen some good ideas for balance in here, and maybe they will get implemented into the game.

{SB}=>Warfleet

PS qu4r quick question, what do i spam? i am puzzled by that because i tend to use mixed fleets except for early game.

Phasic Trap = OP

Kostura = OP

Those are the biggy's though most will agree Scramble Bombers definitely needs work (not nerfed into the floor mind you).

I'm actually happy the way phase missiles are at the moment, as long as Advent gets some way to combat against them. Oh and I can see even Subs being left pretty much the way they are too as long as the other stuff gets done. Every race seems to have an 'ace in the hole' and this seems to be a good one for Vasari.

TEC have Armistice and Hoshi's.

Advent have Shield Regen./Guardian combo and as Darvin has said repeatably, the Halycon is carrying them early on.

The Vasari can have Phase Missiles and Subs as long as Skirantra/Phasic Trap/Kostura's come back into line. 


I don't see how one could mistake Kosturas and Phasic Trap as not overpowered and it does seem troll-like to continue denying it.

while were talking about kosturas.

tec novalith is usefull kostura is very usefull...advent cannon is,,,complete waste of everything

i mean seriously i dont get how the devs didnt test this and say 'wait what is this supposed to do again?'

it does look cool il give them that but seriously is that what ur going for when u spend all that money/time to get them ?

stupidest thing in this game easily no contest, most people have never even seen one let alone know what it does and when u make one and use it it does NOTHING (except look cool )

it should atleast maybe knock off allegeince say 30% or so per shot at targeted planet, maybe for awhile the max allegiance of targeted planet is greatly reduced...something i mean comeon

and also returning armada used to be OP, it got nerfed WAY TO MUCH and now NOONE uses it,

1-please dont do this to the skirantra (nerf it into the ground making it completely useless)

2-can it (RA) maybe be buffed back up to maybe it actualy becomes a part of the game again ?

Not only do deliverance engines largely suck but they at the top of a largely useless tech tree(culture upgrades).  I would be fine with it if the culture research requirement was removed(or lessened) and it was given a small but not insignificant allegiance hit were given.  You don't have to research anything else to get kostura(not sure about novaliths right offhand).  RA is just not used because vasari have so many better things to use than RA so it sits unused mostly.

Don't bother arguing with quar either.  He always trolls to get vasari buffed or to prevent a vasari nerfing.

[_]-Greyfox

I play vasari.  I like vasari. 

I played vasari because vasari was underplayed.  most people were advent or tec.

now...

everyone plays vasari.

I want vas to be nerfed so everyone else stops playing vasari.

kostura should require the phase missile tree like the novalith requires its missile tree

Phase missles are something a vasari is gonna research anyways.  Very few intentionally research the culture upgrades for advent to even get a deliverance or even have reason to build civ labs past 3 for trade.  Put it on the wave tree and then you will be sorta on par with advent or or even closer to advent and be something equally unresearched on the civ tree.

[_]-Greyfox

I ain't no skilled player nor have i ever played multi-player. I have had a total of 4 weeks down time with this game so em basically checking out the forums to learn how to play multiplayer.
In all fairness can someone first play as vasari and defeat qu4r playing as the advent and prove vas is overpowered. Post the damn replay on youtube if u can. where can i see the other replays? Otherwise it boils down to what the forum was seeking to answer which is how to defeat vas uberness and clearly its summed up like this in accordance with the combat mechanics(maybe outdated) forum:

[Stating the obvious for the skilled players, i apologize]

Advent Scouts have 200% advantage vs scouts, lrf and planet bomber frigates? Hence spamming them counters lrf from Vas.
Which concludes the advent have the best and cheapest unit to deal with LRF strategies.(best unit purchase eco on a tier 0 basis i wud think overall best eco for military sakes)

Adding Flak deals with SC accordingly. However supplemented with bombers from Halcyons, (2/3 Chips) and its a huge fleet to deal with. Each level up gives Halcyon more bombers.. with push for anti SC what the hell is everyone complaining about? Wait i know.. its boring to spam. We all do respect but sounds like the advent are the zerg(starcraft 2) of the sins universe. Tactic: Choke enemy fleets with staggering numbers and be victorious.

Any counter for this except choke ? Advent are weak on a equal number basis esp early game- if this is there only card to play then lets not whine about it. I think advent players esp on large maps can spam there way up the hostility tree and get the repair hp vessel. Seems the only way. I'm a noob when it comes to this game and 1 thing i've learnt is do not underestimate any unit even if its called scout yet fires 200% damage advantage with lrf. Wouldnt ignore that.

 Qu4r Now i didnt get how u dealt with with the SB but i know the bombers did a pounding. So basically thats it? No grass hopper speech? U countered every vasari move with with bomber /scout spam lol? No wonder people are pissed.

This thread was created before 1.2 patch when skilled Vasari with 2-4 skirantras from start used to field 60+ bombers in as soon as 15 minutes into the game. Late game vasari has subverters (larger area effect than in 1.2) and kosutra which if fired 6-8 kosutras at same planet destroyed everything but SB in gravity well.

With 1.2 release balance of power is shifted to TEC and Advent. Vasari is still deadly to unskilled player with SB rush and if he has a lot of neutrals but it is much harder for him.

This thread describes game strategies and mechanic of pre 1.2 version and therefore it should die. 

skirantras are still incredilby powerful.

scramble bombers still has the highest damage/antimatter in the game.

and the aoe heal is sill an amazing ability.

As far as my gameplay,the kostra change did not affect me.

a late game vas fleet will still beat a tec late game fleet... the advent match up is a little less pre-determained.

Yes but a Vasari victory won't be as clear...especially on faster speeds, shutting down entire fleets with subverters is exceptionally difficult now and TEC have dem bots which can easily shut down large amounts of firepower in a short period of time...it is to the point where the superior TEC economy can easily rebuild after a military defeat against the Vasari late game...add on the new novalith buff and TEC have a pretty damn good late game...

With 1.2 TEC in late game can just bunker down and spam novaliths and by the way of maltrition eventually Tec will win. TEC doesn't even need to attack. only problem might be heavy bomber spamm and or kosutra jumping way back into the heart of empire. 

I played a game against TEC and before novaliths hit all my planets I had 58 cred per second with about 35 trade ports build. After hit i still owned 2 planets but my eco fell to 14 cred ps with no structures destroyed .....