Unfortunately it also automatically pushes out updates from mod authors who aren't under any obligation not to make breaking changes. I was amazed at the number of Skyrim mods up there now that say things like "make sure you remove all of your items from the chests before updating, because otherwise my new version will DELETE ALL OF YOUR STUFF"... disaster waiting to happen, since Steam doesn't give you a choice not to update mods added via the workshop.

Is it not similar to how it work for any official update from soase... with each new patch, it invalidate previous savegame... why will modders have a obligation that game dev don't respect...

To my knowledge, with soase, when a mod break a game, it is usually because it upgrade from one version of sins to the other...

By the way, in the case of soase, simply adding a mod version number for the main directory name resolve problem... by example, you can have a structure like :

- Mods-Entrenchment v1.052

-- mymod v1.02

-- mymod v1.03

- Mods-Entrenchment v1.053

-- mymod v2.0

Well, it am not sure that the steam mod thing will be able to handle the complex soase structure for mod directories...

By the way, in some case, modders need to make breaking changes for reach the desired effect... for example, i have made long time ago a skin job for Dragon age origins... it was impossible to reach the desired effect in game with playing on the tint parameter... so, for my little mod, you need to run a config tool before begin play for setup a body not shared with other character in game and create a fully new character else the head will be flooting over the body... final result was great, and the more important, the new character was not reversing to basic character in the cinematic scene :

The average user's level of investment in a single Sins match is substantially less than in a game such as Skyrim, but more importantly, Sins patches (outside Steam) aren't automatic. Without forced updates, you're free to finish the map before taking the update if you've read the change notes and saw that saves are invalidated. And game updates are generally spaced months apart with plenty of notice when one is expected.

On the other hand, when you've got myriad mod authors all updating their mods, those updates being pushed to your game without informed consent at the time of each update, *and* those mods have the ability to irrevocably destroy a game you've put hundreds of hours into, that's pretty significant. Developers have reputations to maintain, but if Joe does this with his Super Awesome House mod, he doesn't really have much to lose when he decides he wants to rearrange the furniture and winds up deleting the chest that you've put all your loot in.

And yes, I'm personally opposed to blind automatic updates in general. You should know what you're getting, and when, and have the choice to refuse it (especially in a single player game--in multiplayer games you will need to keep your version matched to others, but your important "stuff" is also generally stored safely server-side in a database).

The game code itself?  (self-supporting)  Anything (features) beyond that can go by the wayside...

Who wants to play a 10min game with some ADD teenager that they don't know, I call up my buddy and we play games that last DAYS...  or did...

As for me, I'm voting with my dollars, if Stardock will let me anyway, I sent a request for a refund for my pre-order into customer support stating STEAM as the reason...

STEAM may be the way of the future, and maybe even the majority, but without me and at least 2 others I know..

BTW:  How did this conversation ever get beyond the Bill of Rights that was so much the foundation of this community, how did it get beyond the general "no DRM" that was so much the theme that created the up-rising in the beginning???

It cost lots of money and time to create good tools for all those features - why the hell do you think Steamworks dont have any real competition?

I'm surprised and disappointed at you Stardock. The one company i could trust to not screw me over with their titles, and yet.....
I hate game clients. Impulse was terrible, but at least you only needed it to install and patch your titles, other than that, you could uninstall it. It's not that i hate Steam specifically, i hate all clients. I would never have used Impulse if it strangled you with the requirements that Steam does.

I admit, i don't know what Steamworks is and why it's such a great thing. I assume it's some how tied to Multiplayer, a feature of SINS i don't use, and would never use with Rebellion.

I cannot believe though it's something that great for Stardock to not hold to their own convictions. Yes..yes, "no alternative, there is only Steam"

Err Brad, you sold the alternative. Again, no steamworks, and again, i don't know...or care.

Apart from GC1 and Elemental (that genre simply holds little interest for me) i have bought every title/expansion from SD without question, this is the first time i have had to consider alternatives.

At the risk of incurring the wrath of many, i'll happily outlay what i see that alternative as being. If Rebellion indeed launches as a Steam game yet can be purchased from SD, i will consider the following.
A purchase of Rebellion at the SD store , then proceed to torrent a cracked version and play that, free from steam and secure knowing that i payed my dollar, and got what I wanted.

Then there would be no achievements. Not sure if the other multiplayer features of Steam rely on Steamworks.

Achievments are only small part of Steamworks

Its major parts are related to multiplayer, cloud saves, community, autoupdates etc.

Impulse was most profitable part of Stardock. Brad wanted to focus on game development, not on digital distribution, so he sold it.

What I meant was: couldn't they sold Impulse but keep Reactor? Reactor is not required for digital distribution but in their control it could be still used for adding multiplayer feature. It was already meant to be used in third party games withour requiring a digital store, so that's why I'm asking if it was not possibile to keep it instead of selling it with Impulse, they are definitly two different product.

To me, none of the features that Steamworks supports are worth the inconvenience. I haven't purchased a game that needed Steam since Dawn of War 2, and I'm going to keep it that way.

So much for the Gamer's Bill of Rights. Learning about that was what go me into Sins in the first place.