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Discussion: Corvettes and Jumping Orkies

Discussion: Corvettes and Jumping Orkies

So, now that I've actually played the game, I can see for myself what everybody was talking about. And, yes, corvettes are, indeed, as powerful as I anticipated.

With regard to jumping Orkulus starbases, Mecha-Lenin provided a neat but imperfect solution: only permit starbases to move into friendly gravity wells.

Personally, I feel that negates one purpose of jump-capable starbases -- that being, they can be used on the offensive.

Consequently, I propose the following: Orkulus starbases can only jump into friendly gravity wells or gravity wells occupied by friendly culture (lore reasoning: the telemetry necessary to permit an Orkie to jump is contingent upon above-average communication between the target and the destination, hence: culture).

This means that your offensive reach is limited by the extent to which you and your allies have spread culture, making culture wars a big part of limiting the mobility of the Orkulus.

On the other hand, this doesn't prevent players from stacking multiple Orkies outside a given gravity well before sending in a suicide team to kill any culture generators in the system. Consequently, I feel that no more than two Orkies can occupy a given gravity well at any given time (stars excepted).

So, TLDR:

  • Orkies can only jump into friendly gravity wells or gravity wells occupied by friendly culture
  • No more than two Orkies can occupy a given gravity well (no more than three can occupy a star)

With regard to corvettes, I feel the following issues need to be addressed:

  • Easily attainable critical mass capable of unstoppable alpha strikes
  • Owing to damage type, armor type, and the array of units they can target, they simply replace light frigates, long-range frigates, and, to an extent, flak and fighters
  • Maneuverability makes them very difficult to hit

To compensate:

  1. As Volt and others have suggested, corvettes need their own armor type that is vulnerable to very specific weapons
  2. Corvettes need three different damage types for their three weapon banks, instead of all three weapons doing composite damage (note that the following damage types do not overlap with fighters or bombers):
    • Bank 1: Anti-medium
    • Bank 2: Anti-heavy
    • Bank 3: Composite
  3. Corvettes should no longer be able to target strike craft
  4. Light frigates and corvettes should be balanced in such a way that light frigates have more health and shields per unit cost than corvettes, and corvettes have more damage per unit cost than light frigates (but less damage per unit cost than long-range frigates). So, hypothetically, the relationship would look something like this (values might have to be weighted to accommodate the critical mass factor where corvettes are concerned):
    • Light frigates: 1.2 health per unit cost, .9 damage per unit cost
    • Corvette: .8 health per unit cost, 1.1 damage per unit cost
    • Long-range frigate: .9 health per unit cost, 1.33 damage per unit cost
  5. Fighters need to be able to speed up and slow down faster; they also need to be able to turn faster; both of these will allow them to target corvettes more easily

This doesn't address corvette speed and maneuverability, but it might be enough; if not, perhaps corvettes should move slower as they take hull damage?

Of course, if this solves the corvette problem, we still have to deal with bombers. Though the fighter change will help allay the problem, I feel that each faction should have an "anti-strike craft alpha strike" ability. The Vasari and Advent already have one (Jam Weapons and Telekinetic Push, respectively), but TK Push needs a range buff to be effective.

I suggest baking anti-strike craft alpha strike capability into the Kol Battleship's Flak Burst: in addition to damage, it temporarily lowers strike craft accuracy by W/X/Y/Z% (Volt suggests that these values should stack with multiple bursts; I don't see the point, since your second burst will probably kill the strike craft anyway).

Discuss.

79,039 views 26 replies
Reply #26 Top

Quoting ShotmanMaslo, reply 26



Quoting AceXMachine,
reply 25
The main reason for this is starbases are designed to be mostly self sufficient. This does not change simply because you slap a phase drive on her.


But yes it does. Starbase that is always in the same location uses dedicated supply line not included in your fleet supply, which lists capacity to supply mobile FTL capable forces. But starbase that can move is basically the same as Titan - it requires much more versatile supplying than stationary structures. If Titans use fleet supply, mobile starbases should too.

Besides, we dont know the supply requirements for  massive phase drives required for jumping starbases (or other ships). It is perfectly justifiable that "slapping phase drive on it" would be a significant investment in terms of increased supply requirements - FTL jumps consume energy (and thus fusion fuel) like nothing else.

This is really only an issue of technobabble justification.

 

I am in favor of all three solutions - make it a second (third?) level of phase stabiliser upgrade, make it cost 50 fleet supply, and add cooldown period after the jump. Its significantly OP, I dont think only one of those is enough, we need all three.
End of ShotmanMaslo's quote

 

Uhh, no it doesn't.  By your example I would not be able to place a starbase in a grav well outside of my influence/supply lines (which I can).  It is already a "serious investment" in additional research but that investment should admittedly be increased (hence my suggestion for a 2-3 step research tree to get the ability, similiar to the twin fortress ability for the TECL, and/or a second upgrade slot requirement for the SB to jump).  You do not NEED all 3.  Fleet supply usage is NOT an option...end of story.  Note, I have never played as VR so I have no stake in giving them an OP advantage.  By that same token, I don't want this ability nerfed into obsolesence.  It is only slightly OP at the moment.  I agree that only 1 of those options may not be enough (unless the cost of the research/upgrade are significant), but asking for all 3 is insane.  The ability should A: require additional research and/or upgrade slot and B: have a cooldown to prevent SB hopping.  What you are suggesting completely destroys this as a valid advantage of the VR, especially on games that have a small/normal fleet size set.  I'm not so concerned about the justification as much as the gameplay.  At the VERY least, we should start with only one of the suggestions(read: not the fleet supply suggestion....ever) and see how it plays out.  If it is still OP, increase cost or add one of the other (valid...again, not fleet supply) suggestions.  Then and ONLY then should using fleet supply even be thought of, much less considered.  I cannot see how, after increasing the research/upgrade requirements(which would weaken the strength of the SB as it would have to trade SC, armor/health or a weapon slot to get) AND cost, that this would still be OP.  At that point, I would be more inclined to believe you are simply being outplayed by a more resourceful VR user.  Forgive me if this comes off as condescending/arrogant.  It is not my intention.