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Dragonman1985
Dragonman1985
Join Date 03/2009
0

Suggestion: Vasari Rebel Titan

June 23, 2012 10:35:12 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

The Vasari are my favorite race, and the Rebel faction is me preference because of it's Titan and special research options. I performed an experiment a few days ago with my Titan...

 

The experiment:             

  • How long will the Vasari Rebel Titan last while using Nano Leech?

 

The conditions:               

  1. Vasari Rebel Titan at level 2
  2. Lost 4 capital ships and 30 Enforcer frigates in that gravity well
  3. Use of Nano Leech as primary ability
  4. 9 enemy capital ships (Level 4 or higher)
  5. ~80 frigates of various types

 

The result:

  • Titan survives exceptionally well

 

Explanation:

The Titan killed 2 capital ships (raised Titan to level 3). The test lasted around 15 minutes before an allied fleet arrived. At the end of the entire encounter my Titan was level 6.

 

Suggestion:

  • Limit the amount of health the Vasari Rebel Titan regenerates with Nano Leech

 

Explanation:

There doesn’t seem to be a limit on how much health the Vasari Rebel Titan can regenerate, which makes it essentially invincible against overwhelming numbers. My Titan went from ~3,500 health to max health (~12,000 at the start of the test) around 5 times during the test (Before the allied fleet arrived).

 

Final Thoughts:

Reducing the health/antimatter gained per second to a cap (Which increases per ship level maybe?) would balance this Titan to the others quite significantly in multi-ship combat. Since the Vasari Rebel Titan has Nano Leech and an ability that disabled ships weapons and abilities if they are affected by it, I feel it’s too strong an ability.

 

Being indestructible against an entire enemy fleet, to me, is a little insane and unbalanced (Regardless of how fun it was!).

 

The experiment was a spur of the moment thing while attempting to evacuate that gravity well... So I don't have a recording of it unfortunately... Is there a way to retrieve a recording of a historical game?

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Dragonman1985
ImperatorPavel
Join Date 06/2010
+23
Reply #1 June 23, 2012 10:53:24 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

You know your last "AutoRecord-number"?  They save periodically, and if you haven't overwritten it yet, it should still be there, in the Auto-Record Single Player file.  That's your redording, which you have if you haven't played any more games.

It'll be where you put mods, screenshots, game saves, etc...

 

Also, everyone, the devs included, know that Nano Leech is OP.  A nerf to that will come in the next balance patch.

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Dragonman1985
Dragonman1985
Join Date 03/2009
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Reply #2 June 23, 2012 10:59:41 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

My thanks! I will see if my new games have not overwritten it yet.

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Dragonman1985
Joccaren
Join Date 06/2008
+3
Reply #3 June 24, 2012 7:34:29 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

A very simple fix for this that could be done by Stardock in about 30 seconds [Hell, I could do it in about 30 seconds]:

Add/edit the "MaxnumberofTargets" or W/E field in the ability's entity file from -1 [Which the game interprets as infinite] to something more like 12 at Lvl 1, 14 at Lvl 2, 16 at Lvl 3 and 18 at Lvl 4 - or some more balanced numbers. I don't play the VR on principle due to their OP titan and OP Starbase jumping, so I'm not sure how those exact numbers would work out. A fair sight better than what is currently there though, I'd think.

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Dragonman1985
zachduyahoo
Join Date 07/2010
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Reply #4 June 24, 2012 2:05:26 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

This has been written about before and while it seems OP'd there is no need for a nerf. All an enemy has to do is not throw tons of frigates at the titan basically meet the VRT with another titan and Caps. Make sure you bring in plenty of ligh carriers outfitted with SC and let them at the titan. This minimizes the ships that the Titan can use Nano Leech on. Its best to have the SC attack the titan 1st before you move in your titan and caps and once the titan is down move in your frigates and engage the remainder of the enemy fleet. So as stated before the nano leech doesnt need a nerf. The opposing player just needs to review their tactics it cant always be about a slugfest between two large fleets head to head, thats not balance. Each titan and caps have their own special abilities and its up to the players to figure a way to counter said abilities via fleet composition or how to engage the enemy fleet, not always asking for an ability to be nerfed.

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Dragonman1985
bilun
Join Date 02/2012
+36
Reply #5 June 24, 2012 6:46:10 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Honestly the most overpowered part of Nanoleech is the AM drain- at the higher ranks, a single nearby enemy more then pays for the cost of the ability, and in any large scale battle it basically becomes "infinite AM for 30 seconds"- this is especially an issue because AM drain is supposed to be a universal titan counter- but doesn't work on later levels of the VRT.

 

Not to mention 300 AM from every enemy capitalship in the battle is too strong considering the ability also hard counters frigates(as it is now, the higher ranks render both the opponent's frigates and capitalships useless)

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Dragonman1985
zachduyahoo
Join Date 07/2010
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Reply #6 June 24, 2012 7:06:08 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Nano leech doesnt affect SC so swarm it with SC and keep your carriers away from the titan. Engage the titan with your titan and caps if you wish but honestly the titan is not overpowered. People just think its overpowered because their usual tactics of sending in their whole fleet fails so honestly something must be wrong. All that is required is simple tactics, using SC and your titan and possibly caps and the deed is done. Send your cruisers and frigates to other of the enemies grav wells and pressure him, by him inadvertently taking your cruisers and frigs out of the fight he is letting you use them somewhere else and of course he will have to send ships in reponse. The titan only seems OP'd because of the tactics people try and use and then dont work

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Dragonman1985
bilun
Join Date 02/2012
+36
Reply #7 June 24, 2012 7:56:00 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting zachduyahoo,
reply 7
Nano leech doesnt affect SC so swarm it with SC and keep your carriers away from the titan. Engage the titan with your titan and caps if you wish but honestly the titan is not overpowered. People just think its overpowered because their usual tactics of sending in their whole fleet fails so honestly something must be wrong. All that is required is simple tactics, using SC and your titan and possibly caps and the deed is done. Send your cruisers and frigates to other of the enemies grav wells and pressure him, by him inadvertently taking your cruisers and frigs out of the fight he is letting you use them somewhere else and of course he will have to send ships in reponse. The titan only seems OP'd because of the tactics people try and use and then dont work

 

Overpowered is not equivalent to utterly uncounterable.  Something being oveprowered has everything to do with the ease of countering it.

 The fact is it hard counters all combat frigates and capitalships in a single ability and in the same ability makes the ship impervious to AM drain- That's simply way too much for a single ability to do.

 

 

Also what happens when the Vasari player brings a bunch of Light frigates with their titan?  LFs destroy carriers, and their opponent can't bring LRF to counter because of nanoleech.  

 

not to mention if the Vasari titan ever catches up(and the vasari have several ways of doing this in general), gravity pulse ends any hope at kiting it further.

 

If the Vasari rebel titan were always alone it would be balanced...but the problem is it will have a supporting fleet.

 

 

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Dragonman1985
Shermyth
Join Date 04/2009
0
Reply #8 June 24, 2012 9:18:30 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

I will say I found this thing to be pretty damned powerful.  I hit a level 10 version with 6 capitol ships 3 starbases(it was at a sun) and about 20 carriers.  20 minutes later I lost a capitol ship and brought the rest of my fleet in to kill it.  This thing had no support and did this.  I did figure out a counter since it came back as level 10 a few more times in the game.  I am not sure it needs a nerf, but it is something that players will need to figure out how to counter.

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Dragonman1985
zachduyahoo
Join Date 07/2010
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Reply #9 June 25, 2012 12:32:32 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Well said sir!!

 

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