@Blaze of Glory
LOL, nice reference to "All you need is love" if that was what you meant.
Yes it was.
Production Wheel. All or Nothing.
The current system for distribution of Production with the 3 interlinked "sliders" promotes the hyper specialization of planets.
Aside from the Population problem.
Choose the greater bonuses for a planet and totally specialize the planet (it does not really matter currently because they are not so very significant).
I am mixed on this. You are correct in it does promote specialization. However, the benefits are not as large as one might expect. Again, it goes back into population means almost everything.
It takes a lot of % bonus before they get significant, because Population is more important in the formula.
I think the 3 sliders should be completely independent and act as "Investment" sliders.
Also, change the order of size for values when percentages are used to avoid any rounding issues and other.
1 unit of Population (billion) produces 1 production point per turn.
--> 1 unit of Population (billion) produces 1000 production points per turn.
I don't really get what you are saying here. It is probably me though.
Basically invest credits in Manufacturing/Research/Wealth to boost them, per example "buy additionnal production points", with a hit to Approval for the Wealth sector, or "buy additionnal % bonus", or something else, all of this depending of the new formula.
For percentage, 1% to 1 = 1.01 rounded down to 1, 5% to 1 = 1.05 rounded down to 1 or rounded up to 1.1, 1% to 1000 = 1010 no need for rounding, 5% of 1000 = 1050 no need for rounding.
It's always better to avoid problems rather than solve them.
Your assessment is forgetting something. Most population planet improvements are flat increases to population (the exception are supposed to be limited, from what I've seen). Factories, labs, and markets are percent increases. Percent increases are more powerful when you have a large base number to work with. If I recall correctly, the base farm is an increase of 2. If you had a population 10 world devoted to manufacturing, and you could build a factory with a 25% bonus to manufacturing, then building that factory would yield greater output than building another farm. In fact, building that factory would strengthen the manufacturing potential of each new farm (25% of 2 would be 0.5).
Before you can get the Manufacturing Center (+25% Manufacturing), you need to research 5 Techs and have enough Techs to be able to enter the Second Research Age.
The Basic Factory (start game) has +10% Manufacturing.
To get the first Farm, you need to research 1 Tech (Xeno Farm / Food +2), the equivalent Manufacturing improvement (1 Tech to research) is the Xeno Factory (+15% Manufacturing).
So, say we have an average planet with 10 free tiles and 10B Pop, spending set to 100% Manufacturing.
(Population * AllocationPercentage) * (1 + ImprovementMod + PlanetMod + StarbaseMod + RacialMod) = Output
No bonus, 1 Xeno Factory (+15% Manufacturing).
((10 + 0) * 1) * (1 + 0.15) = 11.5
No bonus, 1 Xeno Farm (+2 Food).
((10 +2) * 1) * (1 + 0) = 12
No Bonus, 10 Xeno Factories (+15% Manufacturing).
((10 + 0) * 1) * (1 + 1.5) = 25
No Bonus, 10 Xeno Farms (+2 Food).
((10 +20) * 1) * (1 + 0) = 30
Now with bonuses, and I will be very generous with bonuses.
Civ Trait Bonus: 50% Manufacturing
Planet Event Bonus: 50% Manufacturing
Planet Trait Bonus: 100% Manufacturing
Starbase Bonus: 200% Manufacturing
Tech Bonus: 200% Manufacturing
Something I forgot: 200% Manufacturing
Just for Fun: 200% Manufacturing
Total Bonuses 1000% Manufacturing
Bonuses 1000%, 1 Xeno Factory (+15% Manufacturing).
((10 + 0) * 1) * (1 + 0.15 + 10) = 111.5
Bonuses 1000%, 1 Xeno Farm (+2 Food).
((10 +2) * 1) * (1 + 0 +10) = 132
Bonuses 1000%, 10 Xeno Factories (+15% Manufacturing).
((10 + 0) * 1) * (1 + 1.5 + 10) = 125
Bonuses 1000%, 10 Xeno Farms (+2 Food).
((10 +20) * 1) * (1 + 0 + 10) = 330
So with 1000% bonuses, 1 Xeno Farm is better than 10 Xeno Factories (132 / 125).
It's because Improvements do not produce Production Points, they are just % Bonus.
Don't forget that population growth isn't instantaneous. You will need many turns to fill up those worlds (in some cases, many many turns).
Base Population Growth is 0.1 B per turn, so a Xeno Farm (+2 Food) will be filled in 20 turns.
If you have 100% Approval, you get 50% bonus to Population Growth (0.15B per turn), so a Xeno Farm (+2 Food) will be filled in 14 turns.
Even more rapidly if you have other Population Growth bonuses.
This means it will always be better to increase the Population.
Blatantly wrong. The best approach is to balance population with manufacturing/wealth/research buildings. It's a cost-efficiency problem (with the price being the space on your planet). As you build more farms factories/labs/markets become more effective, and vice-versa. Also, farms' benefits are delayed, while factories/labs/markets give an immediate benefit.
With the actual system, for this approach you need to always perfectly balance the Planet Production output 33%/33%/33% (the Planet Production output, not the setting for Planet Production) to be fully efficient. With Population you have total flexibility, 100% Research, or 100% Manufacturing, or 100% Wealth, or 33%/33%/33%, or 70%/20%/10%, etc., the planet is always fully efficient.
So in essence, the problem is that farms are simply OP compared to factories and other specialized improvements: either the farms need to produce less food, or the other improvements need to give bigger bonuses.
I don't think the Farms are OP, they are great the way they are.
I like the idea to be able to have 100+B Population planets, 200+B Population planets, it's fun.
The problem (for me) comes from the formula where Population is the major factor of change. A system where Improvements and Population have an approximatively equal factor of change, and where different bonuses have more influence, would be better balanced. Actually, you can have 20 Factories, if you have 0 Population, you have nothing, you can have 10 000% bonuses, if you have 0 Population, you have nothing.
so its fairly obvious that while the farms are powerfull they are not an i win button and i would say that for any planet < class 5 farms are the answer anything better then that should be specialized
That's not the Farms (the Improvement) that are powerful, it's the Population dominating the formula.
You're correct on everything except the part of only building farms. Without modifiers everything wouldn't be enough to support a late game empire with expensive stuff.
The modifiers have not so great impact, it's the Population that make their power.
No Population, no bonuses.
Higher level farms have an influence bonus instead of a population bonus. I'm not sure if that's a mistake, but if it isn't changed it will be hard to rack up meaningful population bonuses through adjacency.
I think it's a mistake, they should have Population adjacency bonuses.