And you complain that the MB from Marza is overpowered. This fleet from the advent that you are now comlaining about would have eaten a lvl 10+ Marza (or 2) for breakfast.

Crash, screw your capships, screw your ion bolt/magnetize.  We are talking tons of heavy cruisers, lrm, cobalts, etc.  All wiped by a literal handful of ships, multiple times.  It was ridiculous.  It's not an intuitive, normally-balanced game.  If you say it is, we will just have to agree to disagree.

Again, we are talking 70-something cobalts.  If something doesn't strike you as odd or imbalanced by that, then we'll just have to agree to disagree.

Because the carriers were set to bombers, and flak suck against bombers.

didnt say that you did not. just stated that you sorta went off on a tangent a few post back.

Regardless of tons of heavy cruisers, the situation would be solved with one akkan and about 30~40ish cobalts. ion bolt the motherships and 30 cobalts focus fire on each drone host. Some repair cruisers would be good as well.

There is no need of expensive heavy cruisers or anything surplus.

see, the problem is that regardless of how big fleet or whatever, the approach was WRONG in the first place.

By the way, overpowering enemy's fleet with smaller fleet is one of Advent's advantages, and it needs such thing since Advent cannot catch up TEC or Vasari eco that well in med to late game. See, as  Advent I could not count the times when I win over much bigger fleets from other factions using mothership + carrier cap + guardian combo with good illums surrounding my cap.

I think you guys..... while capital ships are indeed underwhelming ships regarding cost, but it seems... you guys underestimate the power of capital ships too much. See, for above example, Advent player was a lot smarter and knew the potential of his caps, while you guys fail to utilize your own caps.

The other guys's caps died.  The Advent player was the only guy dumb enough to keep rebuilding them when his died   Of course, he lucked up with an OP combo, but....

wnmnkh, first off, please quit saying "you" or "you guys."  It was not "me" and I stated this.  It was another group of guys who I know.

Second off, you can say I don't know how to play the game.  That's perfectly fine by me.  But apparently I'm not the only one.  Apparently tons of other people can't figure out how to play it either.  It struck the guys who sent me the replay as odd that 70-something cobalts had an extremely hard time taking out the thing they hard countered (and outnumbered by a ratio of over 7 to 1) because of the presence of 2 motherships.  Now, maybe you don't think that's odd.  Maybe others don't think its odd.  But it struck them all as odd enough to send me the replay of it, and when I saw it I thought it was odd too.  It doesn't strke me as an "intuitive balance" to see 2 ships stop 70-something ships from taking out 10 ships that they hard counter.  It just doesn't.

You know what?

In my humble opinion, the way 2 progs are capable of keeping a small advent fleet alive against huge amounts of enemies is THE way cap ships should work.

Will 2 progenitors wipe a whole enemy fleet in 25 seconds? No they will not.
They are a tremendously good support for your fleet and THAT is what I believe cap ships should do.

Advent is the leader in this case, having a ton of abilities that support the fleet very well.
Other races are waaaay behind in how well their caps are synergized with thir fleets.
Oh, and on top of that, TEC get the Marza.

70 cobalta x 10 dps each is 700 dps against 130 shield regen of both mothers,the guys just didnt focus fire,noobs mistake.now lets get back to the topic

yea.NERF THE DAMN MARZA!

The question is wrong.

No, I am not asking about "skills".

I am asking about "understanding".

You will be sorry if you think skills = understanding, those are completely different things.

I don't mind listening from people about balance problem that who have either low, high or equal skills compared to me. But I do have problem with people that who do not understand the game in the first place.

And yes, it is possible to be one that while don't understand the game, but have enough skills to win.

See, for that example above, it was NOT 'skill' problem (since attackers killed two first). But it was understanding problem that they do not recoginize;

1.) Idealy capitals should be countered by other capitals.

2.) Nature of Advent.

See, maybe godlike micro and skills MIGHT be helpful in that situation, but better understanding (get Akkan and ion bolt motherships) would be much painless.

And I think those people who do not understand basic principles of the game should not post anything about game balance.

I hope you understand what I am saying.

Edit : OK, I really want to see that two motherships replay, but again, it is not hard to imagine what happened....

they ARE resistent to carriers,in the same way they are resistant to fighters.

http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=p7xc_snd9Cc-6o2UwvPEWUg&gid=1

...guys just did something wrong,I've killed more carriers with less assaults frigs and less loses among them.Its just the players that did something wrong....show me the replay because its actually hard to believe they did it all fine and still had such a pyrric victory.

Agent, your friend made a terrible mistake, you can't ignore the strikecraft! The fleet composition of your friend was 70 Cobalts (350 supply points). What he should have done is build 55 Flak Frigates (220 supply points) + 26 Cobalts (130 supply points). If he had done this, we would have won easily with minimal loses. Remember that even if you destroy the carrier, the strikecraft remain active for about a minute after the host is destroyed. When trying to counter Carriers, you have to take out the strikecraft first. Image a fleet of 2 Progenitor + 10 Aetria Drone Host + ZERO strikecraft.

When you encounter an enemy carrier fleet, dont just count the carriers but also how many squadrons he has. When facing stikecraft, I always try to have about a 2 to 1 ratio Flak/Strikecraft, the same with LF/Carriers. Light frigates attacking carriers without Flak support is just plain dumb!

55 Flak Frigates vs. 30 Bomber squadrons
26 Cobalts vs. 10 Carriers

= easy victory!

Anyway, back on topic, I guess IC doesn't care about MB. It would have been fun to see what Blair had to say about MB.

LOL