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[MOD WIP] Wing Commander Legacy

By on September 19, 2012 3:31:34 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

nightreign

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-= Wing Commander: Legacy =-

The year is 2711 and the galaxy is once more in turmoil. Ten years of peace has brought new heights of trade and commerce, but it has also brought complacency to the galactic powers and the different factions are once more growing restless in the confines of their territories.

After the events of the Nephilim War, the Terran Confederation is finally able to breathe a sigh of relief as the last threat to their galaxy has been push back towards the galactic core. The TCS Midway returns home heroes and Lt. Lance Casey is the new face of the Confederation after the loss of the legendary Christopher Blair. Though their military might has been downsized, new advances in technology help ease the burden. With the focus on commerce and diplomacy, the Terran Confederacy is able to forge long lasting alliances with the Free Republic of Landreich and the Union of Border Worlds. Humans have finally found the peace that they have been looking for.

The years of peace has not been as kind to the Kilrathi Assembly of Clans. Since the destruction of Kilrah, the surviving clans have been entangled in a civil war for supremacy waging across their sector of space. The Nephilim War brought a brief truce to the clan wars in order to join the Terran Confederation in fighting back the demons of Shivar. When the war finally ended with the destruction of the wormhole gate, the Kilrathi returned back home with a renewed lust for the hunt. The clan wars quickly were reignited with a fierce and bloody passion that ended with the rise of Ragitagha clan and the crowning of Emperor Karsh. With a unified empire and a warrior hunter for an emperor, the Kilrathi are poised to strike out once more.

Since their defeat at the hands of the Terrans and the Kilrathi, the Nephilim have returned to their corner of the galaxy to lick their wounds and rebuild their near total loses in the failed invasion. Tapping into their vast resources in their home sectors, the Nephilim quickly begin rebuilding and planning their next move into fulfilling their quest to conqueror the entire galaxy. Heavy research is taken into human and kilrathi technology from the large number of bodies and ships that were captured during their first campaign, allowing the Nephilim to develop deadlier weapons to achieve victory in their enemies. After ten years, the rebuilding effort and advances in technology have been completed and a new wormhole gate has been opened in the Hari sector to begin the invasion for the final time.

-= Terran Confederation =-

A combination of the Confederation, the Border Worlds and the Landreich Republic, the TC specialize in commerce, fast building ships, carrier strike groups and tapping into the human spirit to defy the odds.

Fighters

Arrow light fighter, Hellcat medium fighter, Thunderbolt heavy fighter, Dragon supremacy fighter, Broadsword bomber, Longbow bomber

Frigates

Galaxy-class colony ship, Bonnie Heather-class scout ship, Phoenix-class escort corvette, Tarawa-class escort carrier, Eagle-class missile corvette, Falcon-class anti-fighter frigate, Drayman-class starbase constructor

Cruisers

Bengal-class strike carrier, Hades-class missile cruiser, Tallahassee-class utility cruiser, Waterloo-class Intel cruiser, Gettysburg-class heavy cruiser

Capital Ships

Concordia-class fleet carrier, Exeter-class destroyer, Gilgamesh-class battleship, Paradigm-class planetary assault, Washington-class utility battlecruiser

Titan

Midway-class megacarrier

-= Kilrathi Empire =-

As collection of clans, the Kilrathi empire is a military juggernaught after years of peace allowed them to rebuild numbers and technology. They specialize in military technology, stealth, power over speed and the hunter’s spirit that guides them on their hunt for victory.

Fighters

Dralthi-class light fighter, Drakhri IV-class medium fighter, Gratha-class heavy fighter, Vaktoth-class supremacy fighter, Asjaka-class bomber, Paktahn-class bomber

Frigates

Lumbari-class colony ship, Melek-class scout ship, Kamekh-class escort corvette, Karga-class escort carrier, Kamrani-class missile corvette, Targu-class anti-fighter frigate, Dukara-class starbase constructor

Cruiser

Snakeir-class strike carrier, Butha-class missile cruiser, Jrathek-class utility cruiser, Strakha-class stealth cruiser, Fralthi-class heavy cruiser

Capital Ship

Bhantkara-class fleet carrier, Ralatha-class destroyer, Ralari-class battleship, Sivar-class planetary assault, Kiranka-class utility battlecruiser

Titan

Hakaga-class megacarrier

-= Nephilim Empire =-

Believing themselves to be the First Beings from which the universe created, the Nephilim spread across the galaxy like locusts in order to claim what they believe is theirs by divine right. They specialize in rapid transit, pack mentality and strong shield technology as well as the divine spirit which guides their hand along the righteous path of the gods.

Fighters

Moray light fighter, Manta medium fighter, Remora heavy fighter, Devil Ray supremacy fighter, Lamprey bomber, Sting Ray bomber

Frigates

Catfish-class colony ship, Snakehead-class scout ship, Swordfish-class escort corvette, Barracuda-class escort carrier, corvette, Tiger Shark-class missile corvette, Piranha-class anti-fighter frigate

Triton starbase constructor

Cruisers

Hydra-class strike carrier, Pike-class missile cruiser, Marlin-class utility cruiser, Salamander-class utility cruiser, Great White-class heavy cruiser

Capital Ships

Leviathan-class Fleet Carrier, Orca-class destroyer, Kraken-class battleship, Hammerhead-class planetary assault, Otter-class utility battlecruiser

Titan

Tiamat dreadnought

-= A Note from the Designer =-

I have a special place in my heart for Wing Commander. The first WC was the first computer game I ever played and I have fond memories with my father playing the game. I have long toyed with the idea of modding SoaSE based on my experience of some excellent mods that have been produced by this community. Since my father’s passing from cancer, I finally decided to put the doubt to the side and jump in with both feet and develop my own mod for this great game with a universe close to my heart.

-= Design Goals =-

I have never created a mod before so this will be my first attempt. That said, I’m still learning the ins and outs of creating a mod and what SoaSE can and cannot do. Ideally, I would like to design the mod to be space fighter and carrier specific with many sets of fighters that can be used as that is truly the heart of what Wing Commander is. If that proves too difficult or impossible to implement, then my next idea is to “bump” the beloved fighters and bombers to the larger frigate roles. It isn’t ideal, but it allows for the most familiar and detailed aspect of Wing Commander to be in the game.

My first goal is to get one race out there fully done. This will be my learning curve so this will take the longest. Hopefully, once the first race is done, the other two can be released more quickly. If there is anyone out there that wants to jump in and help, I’m certainly open to working with others. As I’ve stated previously, I have never created a mod before so I’m learning as I go with the resources on this forum as my guide.

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September 19, 2012 4:03:45 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

WC was my first video game too. 

Too bad its so outdated. I managed to get my hands on a SNES copy and it was miserable terrible... I have no idea how I managed to beat the game through my SNES. Later I had it on computer. 1, 2, 3, and whatever was after that. I remember the behemoth being destroyed before my eyes, having to kill Hobbes, and of course dropping the bomb on Kilrah.

It was all freaking amazing.

Too bad its a bigone era and nobody seems to like space sims anymore. Freespace 2 (and later the blue planet series) are the only things that come anywhere close in the last decade.

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September 19, 2012 4:24:56 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Yeah, it may be outdated, but I still find them fun, probably more from the nostalgia side than anything else. Though the Wing Commander Saga fan project isn't half bad and there is a rumor that Chris Roberts might be putting out a new space sim game next year.

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September 19, 2012 4:26:11 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting ,


I have never created a mod before so this will be my first attempt. That said, I’m still learning the ins and outs of creating a mod and what SoaSE can and cannot do. Ideally, I would like to design the mod to be space fighter and carrier specific with many sets of fighters that can be used as that is truly the heart of what Wing Commander is. If that proves too difficult or impossible to implement, then my next idea is to “bump” the beloved fighters and bombers to the larger frigate roles. It isn’t ideal, but it allows for the most familiar and detailed aspect of Wing Commander to be in the game.

I sadly know almost nothing about wing commander. However, I highly recommend you check out our modder supported "Get an Answer thread" to get answers on game mechanics. For the record, fighters are much more restrictive on what you can do with them than say frigates (You'll probably find how frustrating that is later). In addition, they cannot have shield or phase jump no matter what you do to them. You can have any number of fighter squads you want, and these can have research and cost resources, but you can only have 4 different types of squadrons per carrier (so if you had two different carrier ships, you could host 8 different squads between the two).

If these restrictions prove to much, you may find it easier to implement them as corvettes, as these can do anything frigates can do but move like fighters. The only thing is they cannot be grouped into squads like fighters can, but if for something like a large bomber it can work quite well.

Hope to see some models and stuff soon.

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September 19, 2012 4:34:30 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

I don't know much about wing commander beyond the movie...

But here's a resource site if you haven't found it yet.

http://wcmdf.solsector.net/

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September 19, 2012 4:36:34 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Good information to know GoaFan77 about the fighters vs. corvettes. I will have to play around with it and see which way I like best. If fighter hit points and damage and adjustable, that might be worth playing around with.

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September 19, 2012 5:29:00 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting nightreign,
Good information to know GoaFan77 about the fighters vs. corvettes. I will have to play around with it and see which way I like best. If fighter hit points and damage and adjustable, that might be worth playing around with.

Oh you can change all of that basic stuff easily. You could give a fighter more health and weapons than a titan if you so wanted to.

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September 19, 2012 5:44:55 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

No dralthi fighters? They are the classic WC universe fighters. i am surprised they are not listed.

Sins would be the game to do a port of the WC universe, but not sure how you going to pull off weapons, and stats for ships. Not impossible, but quite the challenge. WC universe is well documented for stats. So you shouldnt have issues there.

Looking forward to see your progress.

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September 19, 2012 6:01:03 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Major Stress,
No dralthi fighters? They are the classic WC universe fighters. i am surprised they are not listed.

Huh, I should have my geek card yanked for missing the dralthi fighter.

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September 19, 2012 7:18:43 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

I'd love to see a WC mod for Sins of a Solar Empire.  I can do .entity coding, so if you want my help with that consider it offered.

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September 19, 2012 7:45:16 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting ZombiesRus5,
I don't know much about wing commander beyond the movie...

Please do not judge the game by its movie. Please.

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September 19, 2012 8:30:42 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting SpardaSon21,
I'd love to see a WC mod for Sins of a Solar Empire.  I can do .entity coding, so if you want my help with that consider it offered.

Thank you, it is much appreciated. I haven't gotten to those files just yet, but I'm sure I will have plenty to do once I get there.

Quoting Ryat,

Quoting ZombiesRus5, reply 5I don't know much about wing commander beyond the movie...

Please do not judge the game by its movie. Please.

Yeah, the movie wasn't that great, but the soundtrack was actually somewhat decent. The games are awesome though for their time and the depth of plot, theme and world are amazing, especially when you add in the novels.

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September 19, 2012 9:18:04 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Just because....

http://www.wcsaga.com/

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September 19, 2012 11:50:28 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

The Movie was absolutely atrocious! So yea Do Not base any judgement from that. First 3 games were awesome in the day. WC started to tank as a franchise after Price of Freedom. Though I liked Prophecy, and Secret Ops. It seems that nobody else did.

Models themselves should be easy to port over. If you use models from the original game they may need some work, because of the low poly counts, and resolutions of the late 90's. They may look real bad in sins in their original form.

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September 20, 2012 9:27:17 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

There are a fair amount of models out there already thankfully so I should be able to get a fair amount ported over assuming I can get permission to use them. As for updating or making new ones, that will take a little longer as I'm not overly experienced with making them, but I am an amateur digital artist so that counts for something...I hope

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September 20, 2012 11:26:30 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

It is too bad you aren't using the Vesuvius at all since 7 Deadly Sins has one fully in-game.

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September 20, 2012 11:50:34 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

They do? Neat, I will have to take a look at that. The list given in the intro is by no means the final list. It is the initial design list based on what I want. The list may changed depending on what I can get and/or create

Or add more ships. I assume it isn't that hard to add more cap ship options than what is currently available in the game?

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September 20, 2012 12:37:51 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Not at all.  If you've got a .entity file coded you can just add that file to your PlayerRace.entity file in the capital ship listing and it will show up.

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September 20, 2012 1:14:03 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

I sense more carriers in my future

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September 20, 2012 1:41:40 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

It's also very easy to give different ships different fighters. If you want the AI to play more effectively, you could even do something like say restrict bombers to X and Y carriers while A and B carriers have fighters, as the AI randomly selects which fighters a ship will have. You can have a total of 18 frigates (9 on each "page") and 9 capital ships, and each of those ships can have up to four different (or same) fighter/bomber squadrons.

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September 21, 2012 9:29:42 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Plus the actual role of a ship does not have to match the vanilla sins "roletyes". Except in a few hard coded slots like the colony, siege and scout types. Which there must be at least one of each for the AI to function correctly. My rule of thumb is to have at least one of every roletype/statcounttype in each faction just to be safe.

RoleType determines how the AI makes a ship behave in game. StatCountType makes the AI determine how many of these ships to build. Roletype does not have to match the statcounttype, but you may want to mimic vanilla sins just to be sure the AI doesnt spazz out on you. If you are missing any roletypes like scout, siege, or colony roletype/statcounttypes. The AI will stall, and not build anything, or expand at all. Again mimic vanilla sins just to be safe.

You can have 2 roletypes per ship. Example a ship can have Carrier, and Heavy Cruiser roletypes. Another good example is the Anti Structure roletype. You can make anti structure units attack ships by adding Heavy Cruiser, or LRM as a second roletype. Just make sure you keep anti structure as the primary or it wont function.

AFAIK you can make more than one frigate slot be a carrier, and have command points for fighters (I believe SoGE did this). And yes you can have different fighter/bomber types specific for each type of carrier. For example you can have a Concordia class with Rapier fighters, and Broadsword bombers, and a Midway class with Vampire fighters, and Shrike bombers.

While you can have 4 types of strike craft per ship it is best to stick with vanillas 2 types. Right now there is a CPU lag issue that too many strike craft plays part of a role in.

 

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September 21, 2012 11:17:38 AM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Thank you all for the great advice, it is sure to save me a headache in the future.

Does anyone know if they are working on the CPU lag issue?

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September 21, 2012 12:36:55 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Major Stress,
AFAIK you can make more than one frigate slot be a carrier, and have command points for fighters (I believe SoGE did this). 

Confirming this; we have had ships that have multiple fighter squads, and do not have the carrier RoleType/statCountType. The AI will still build fighters on those ships, and not only that, it will "understand" that the ship has fighters.

For example, if you have a frigate with a fighter squadron, the Heavy RoleType, and FrigateHeavy statCountType, the AI will build more of this heavy frigate than if it did not have fighters. At times it will even build these in addition/instead of dedicated carrier ships; most of the time the AI is really unpredictable when it comes to different RoleType/statCounType combos, let alone ones with fighters.

Edit: Also I've given ships more than 2 roleTypes, I've put 4 on some, and the AI uses it as intended.

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September 21, 2012 4:31:22 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

Right now as part of my design process, I'm thinking of using multiple fighters that have different roles and then spreading those out among the different ships. For the TCS we have:

Fighters and Bombers

Arrow-class light fighter (strong vs. frigates)

Hellcat-class medium fighter (strong vs. bombers)

Thunderbolt-class heavy fighter (strong vs. cruisers)

Dragon-class supremacy fighter (strong vs. fighters)

Broadsword-class bomber (strong vs. cap ships/structures)

 

We then spread those fighters out among the different cap ships and some cruisers which helps define their roles. The idea is design balance around needing a complete fleet. The carriers contain offensive ships while the support ships such as destroyers and cruisers provide fighter cover against other fighters and bombers. The titan, being the juggernaught of the fleet, takes a more balanced role of ships to reinforce its singular nature.

Cruisers

Bengal-class strike carrier - Thunderbolt, Broadsword

Gettysburg-class heavy cruiser - Dragon

Waterloo-class Intel cruiser - Hellcat

Cap Ships

Concordia-class fleet carrier - Arrow, Thunderbolt, Broadsword

Vesuvius-class super carrier - Arrow, Thunderbolt, Dragon, Broadsword

Exeter-class destroyer - Hellcat, Dragon

Gilgamish-class battleship - Thunderbolt, Broadsword

Washington-class battlercruiser - Hellcat, Dragon

Midway-class Titan - Hellcat, Thunderbolt, Dragon, Broadsword

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September 21, 2012 5:24:40 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

I'd put the Arrow as anti-fighter and the Dragon as anti-frigate.  The Arrow is a lighter, faster fighter with a much more limited weapons load compared to the Dragon, especially when when flash packs are considered.

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September 21, 2012 5:47:25 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire Forums Sins of a Solar Empire Forums

In keeping with the roles of the ships, if we shifted Arrow to anti-fighter, I would move Thunderbolt to anti-frigate and then slide Dragon to anti-cruiser, just to keep the progression of fighter and target equal.

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