Well said!  Looking forward to playing this  again once they make it a classic.

Agree. Good post.

I must admit, I never thought I'd see a time when farmville and Starcraft II were described as similiar types of games. You do realize farmville is a game where you plant crops and then have to come back the next day (or sometimes multiple days) to harvest them. It's not exactly fast paced.

You realize that Brad created his first turn based game engine in 1991, right?  Elemental isn't his first game.

The game is already fun.  If you don't like it, then you don't like 4X...you should try Starcraft.

This thread should be called What Elemental is trying to do right. A game is not automatically good just because it is trying to do right. It's good when it succeeds in doing it.

So, can anyone get back on topic and tell me what's so great about this game ? My favourite games in the genre are Master of Magic and Age of Wonders: Shadow Magic. I know bugs and issues can be squashed, but if gameplay is fundamentally flawed somewhere then there's no hope. What does Elemental do better (more interesting etc.) than MOM or AOW:SM ? Are there any mechanics not present in the two games which genuinely work well and make Elemental good ? From what I gather Diplomacy, Questing, and dynasties aren't worth much effort.

Seriously, WHY do you keep coming into threads and crapping on people who have legitimate complaints?

I can make a very strong argument that Elemental is at best a very shallow example of a true 4x game.  It has tremendous potential but has barely scratched the surface in some cases (bland city building choices, wide "variety of units that have no real differences except the gear you slap on them, magic system with 20x of "shoot one group for X" and "shoot all groups in 1 radius for X" but precious little differentiation) to the completely BROKEN parts of the game (diplomacy is a 1 dimensional joke, AI is beyond braindead even on "ridiculous", magic is completely craptacular outside of auto resolved combat, 100 amulet/ring exploits, etc.)

I want to see more posts like Mrbrad has made 'cause he obviously has a vested interest in seeing this game truly kick some serious TBS ass as do the majority of those on the forums.

That said, some of your points are overstated (there have been quite a few successful TBS games since MoM) but in all reality there is a ginormous dearth of them presently.  And even less so for the fantasy ones as the last I remember is the mostly forgettable Armies of Exigo a couple of years back.  So I have a great deal of respect for Stardock risking something this underrepresented in a market that is far more into shooters than just about anything else.

And as much as the art style seems to not sit well with lots of posters, I'm rather enjoying it.  I'm far more into a stylized/artistic fantasy feel to this sort of game than the Starcraft approach.  I wouldn't mind a TBS with that level of graphics, but realistically it isn't in the cards and gameplay >>>>>>>> graphics everyday of the week and twice on Sunday

Legitimate "constructive" complaints are fine, but I'm getting a little tired of hearing about how EMOM is "unplayable"...that's bull.  It's very playable, and very fun.

But what if said complaint of "unplayable" is legitimate depending on playstyle?

If, for example, I want to play a heavy magic sovereign "nuker" how well does this game work for me?  I can bring along lots of support troops and "champions" (so quoted since they're anything but) but will never see any sort of huge damage output since a HUGE bug somehow managed to squeak out of beta...  namely shards not working outside of auto resolve.  Or the fact that the insanely limited magic resources I have can be used for spells that not only frequently hit for single digit damage or hell even miss.  My choice of this playstyle is completely legitimate and quite workable in other fantasy TBS games so why is it nigh impossible until the very high end when spells actually start doing something of note on the damage scale?

So, in your estimation am I a "hater" as you put it?  I find many aspects of the game quite unplayable as they stand and as a whole it's rather broken in many respects.

That would be a more plausible argument if playing magic-heavy characters wasn't one of the game's core selling points!

THIS is why I actually bought the game. Its called Elemental: War of Magic for a reason. At least, I thought that meant something.

Mrbrad, this isn't to take away from your points either. In fact, I agree with a number of them. However, even all of them combined do not make up for the present state of the game.

Here's what I like. Forewarning this is a perspective of pretty much a 4x newbie...obviously don't understand the detailed working of things. Normal difficulty was designed with me in mind!

-Graphics. Game has a great look. I really like the "painted" visuals of the game. Very unique and fantasy feel.

- City Building. I like watching my city grow, and I like that its not as simple as randomly placing a building. Seeing people working and chatting in city when zoomed adds some flavor. (though max buildings is a mess right now imo, needs to be better explained why u cnt build when tiles are open)

- Tech trees. Seem pretty in-depth and there is def strategy in which/when to level up. More choices than I am used to, love it!

- Tact battles. I'm just glad they made it in. Auto resolve is too random for me. I also like that 6 spearmen show up on a tile rather than a single unit with a number attached. (anxiously awaiting major updates to entire tact battle system.) I'm spoiled from heroes of might and magic. Needs more tactics =P

- Unit design. LOVE being able to make my own unit regardless of the depth. Another feature I cant wait to see 6 months from now. (I agree though, needs more strategy involved......need a reason to take spear over reaver sword)

- Cloth Map. Simple feature that just gives the game a unique feel. Easy to zoom out and identify resources, quests, etc.

Overall I like everything about the game. I just feel all of the systems need to be fleshed out more and given some direction. I've played over 8 hours in 1 game; 3 hours of which have been in an intense war with Kraxis (seriously... they sent 3 armies of 1500 points/defense (whichever =p) to my capital 3 turns in a row. It was crazy but I successfully defended (i.e. exactly why tact battles > auto resolve). We've been swapping cities back and forth; we are gridlocked in an epic struggle for the ages.

But that right there just says what a good game this is/can be. Any other game out there with performance issues I'd drop in a heartbeat, but this game I am STILL enjoying regardless.

Agree with OP 100%