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Volt_Cruelerz
Volt_Cruelerz
Join Date 06/2008
+115

Make Culture Movement Visible

April 13, 2012 8:33:32 PM from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Yes, there is a thread by nearly the same name, but this is a separate yet similar topic.  It'll make sense.  

Something that has bugged me for a while but I've never thought about consciously until the other day regarding a solution is the fact that it's often times hard to tell which way culture is travelling.  I'm not suggesting making it move faster as SageWon is.  I'm suggesting perhaps the addition of a little arrow graphic or something to indicate the direction it's travelling on the phase lane.  For instance, you have phase lane A:

O=========O


That's rather difficult to tell which way the culture is going.  Perhaps add some simple little arrows.  Below, let's represent red culture beating blue:

O===>=====O


Now, let's represent them being even (or very very close)

O===>|<====O

 

This would be IMO a lot better than the current system because rather than having to zoom closely and wait a few seconds to watch the color shift a few pixels, you could just quickly at a glance tell which culture is winning.

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SithLordAJ
Join Date 04/2008
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Reply #1 April 13, 2012 8:42:45 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

sure, why not?

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TheChronicToast
Join Date 03/2008
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Reply #2 April 13, 2012 8:47:21 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

This is a good idea, though it depending on how this feature is coded into the game and how hard it would be to change it may or may not happen.

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RedDwarf999
Join Date 11/2008
+25
Reply #3 April 13, 2012 8:53:12 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Yes, as an Advent Rebel I want to keep a close and quick eye on my creep, er, culture spread.  Build more overlords!

And please do this it's a jolly good idea. 

 

 

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mcintire
Join Date 04/2010
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Reply #4 April 14, 2012 7:55:37 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Like it as well, seems helpful.

Maybe also an indicator on the gravity well indicating directly on the HUD wether your and/or enemy culture is sinking or rising. I have no problems figuring it out on my own wells, but sometimes the allegiance change on enemy planets I'm taking is kinda confusing and I'd like to know if I need another caphsip there or my starbase needs a culture upgrade to push the culture back.

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Mr. Haze
Join Date 05/2009
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Reply #5 April 14, 2012 7:56:36 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

It's fairly easy to check if you zoom in on the phase lane itself, but I don't see a problem with this suggestion.

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gundamlit
Join Date 03/2012
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Reply #6 April 14, 2012 9:44:09 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

I am afraid the suggestion may cost too much effort, and therefore it is not likely to be seen.

 

I suggest another way, that the weaker side will have a notice on the planet info card, something like "Our culture is being repelling". The effort may be rather small, since there is already warning when the weaker side is about to lose its planet.

 

However the problem is how to deal with the stallment state. Maybe another notice can be displayed that "We are resisting the hostile culture".

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Volt_Cruelerz
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Reply #7 April 14, 2012 9:53:35 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

I'm assuming you meant too much effort?  Surely they can get the endpoints of the culture lines on the phase lanes, so then, it's just a matter of printing an image to the screen at various rotations, not much different than the ticks used to indicate fleet strength.

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gundamlit
Join Date 03/2012
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Reply #8 April 16, 2012 10:20:33 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Volt_Cruelerz,
reply 7
I'm assuming you meant too much effort?  Surely they can get the endpoints of the culture lines on the phase lanes, so then, it's just a matter of printing an image to the screen at various rotations, not much different than the ticks used to indicate fleet strength.

Yes.

And unfortunately though a firmware developer, it is obviously totally different to write codes between for PC games and for DSP devices. So I am afraid the coding is not as easy as you thought. But, well, it may also possible to be very easy, than it will be a great deal.

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Teun-A-Roonius
Join Date 10/2009
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Reply #9 April 16, 2012 10:50:27 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting gundamlit,
reply 8
And unfortunately though a firmware developer, it is obviously totally different to write codes between for PC games and for DSP devices. So I am afraid the coding is not as easy as you thought. But, well, it may also possible to be very easy, than it will be a great deal.
I happen to be studying software development (only have one year left at university) and I have looked into the game's code for quite a bit. An arrow like Volt mentioned at the end of a culture line shouldn't be too hard to do. It might even be extremely simple, though in my experience over the years nothing ever is as simple as it sounds...

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drutter117
Join Date 03/2012
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Reply #10 April 16, 2012 11:15:55 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

I also happen to be a magician and I declare that today is for flip flops only.

 

Also we should make this happen.

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TheChronicToast
Join Date 03/2008
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Reply #11 April 16, 2012 12:54:47 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting Teun-A-Roonius,
reply 9
I have looked into the game's code for quite a bit.

 

You've looked inside the .exe? (Isn't that ... like illegal or something according the EULA you signed?)

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duxupia
Join Date 04/2012
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Reply #12 April 16, 2012 1:06:45 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Agreed.   Zooming in on the end of a culture line or culture meeting point is a bit of a pain IMO, but I do it fairly often because that is the only option.  I like to know where things are headed.  Sometimes things shift unexpectedly.  Seeing a simple arrow would be keen.

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Sonntagshut
Join Date 04/2009
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Reply #13 April 16, 2012 4:44:40 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Well, there would always be the option left, to just have an effect phase jump from one planet to another in the direction of the culture flow . (Though it might be hard to also be able to determine the strength/speed of the change with a tool like this)

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Volt_Cruelerz
Join Date 06/2008
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Reply #14 April 16, 2012 5:41:48 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting gundamlit,
reply 8

Quoting Volt_Cruelerz, reply 7I'm assuming you meant too much effort?  Surely they can get the endpoints of the culture lines on the phase lanes, so then, it's just a matter of printing an image to the screen at various rotations, not much different than the ticks used to indicate fleet strength.


Yes.

And unfortunately though a firmware developer, it is obviously totally different to write codes between for PC games and for DSP devices. So I am afraid the coding is not as easy as you thought. But, well, it may also possible to be very easy, than it will be a great deal.

I'm a CS major with intent to go into game design and am a programmer for a PC FPS as well as a mechanics designer for an action RPG, so I am rather familiar with game code.  Perhaps not this engine, but I do know how to code.  And unless the game/engine is really bizarrely written, adding an element to the UI shouldn't be hard.  Just add sprites, which is clearly possible at varying angles which surely the Iron Engine supports, and if it doesn't, it should.  It also clearly has the ability to draw in any given color, so I'm really not seeing a reason why this would be difficult.  All components are present so far as I can tell.

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SithLordAJ
Join Date 04/2008
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Reply #15 April 16, 2012 7:28:48 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

well, of course the engine supports sprites, and of course it could have arrows if they really wanted to put them in there. The reason why they may not has to do with the difficulty. Let me explain...

If the current method of coloring phase lanes uses sprites (which I kinda doubt) or in some way has a similar interface to effects, it should be fairly simple. However, if they 'cheated' a bit and are just drawing lines through direct calls and/or might have a hard time finding the 'collision point'... it might not be so simple to do...

As such, they could still do it, but would require writing new effects, which might be deemed 'not worth the effort'. I personally would rather get an extra scenario (assuming they're being worked on) or another few balance tweaks than this, but if it can be done simply, I'm all for it

Then again, even if they did do it with lines, it might be simple. Bottom line is, we asked, and we shall see.

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sareth01
Join Date 08/2008
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Reply #16 April 16, 2012 7:36:27 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

I like how culture is right now.  It means that you might be lulled into complacency and there are no easy ways to notice how your culture is being infiltrated.  "Surprise!" your culture is losing.  Usually if you are concerned about culture you will spend your valuable time to determine if you are winning/losing.  Improving efficiency in this way would negate the "feel" of using culture effectively and limit your options when trying to manipulate an opponent.

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Reply #17 April 16, 2012 10:51:49 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting SithLordAJ,
reply 15
well, of course the engine supports sprites, and of course it could have arrows if they really wanted to put them in there. The reason why they may not has to do with the difficulty. Let me explain...

If the current method of coloring phase lanes uses sprites (which I kinda doubt) or in some way has a similar interface to effects, it should be fairly simple. However, if they 'cheated' a bit and are just drawing lines through direct calls and/or might have a hard time finding the 'collision point'... it might not be so simple to do...

As such, they could still do it, but would require writing new effects, which might be deemed 'not worth the effort'. I personally would rather get an extra scenario (assuming they're being worked on) or another few balance tweaks than this, but if it can be done simply, I'm all for it

Then again, even if they did do it with lines, it might be simple. Bottom line is, we asked, and we shall see.

I'd assume that they are straight draw line functions.  That said, surely one can relatively easily access what percentage the phase lane is of a given color, then take the coordinates of the two planets and you could find the midpoint.

 

Quoting sareth01,
reply 16
I like how culture is right now.  It means that you might be lulled into complacency and there are no easy ways to notice how your culture is being infiltrated.  "Surprise!" your culture is losing.  Usually if you are concerned about culture you will spend your valuable time to determine if you are winning/losing.  Improving efficiency in this way would negate the "feel" of using culture effectively and limit your options when trying to manipulate an opponent.

And I suppose you could elect to ignore or disable the arrows, but any reasonable player isn't going to let that happen.  The sneakiness doesn't have to do with the lack of an indicator, it's the distraction elsewhere that would keep them from noticing.  Really, what this does is shave off seconds, just like the Empire Tree does, just it does it for civilian purposes instead of military.

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CirdanNarya
Join Date 08/2009
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Reply #18 April 16, 2012 11:27:38 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

So, I apologize if this was mentioned earlier in the thread, but I am really tired and did not read past the second response.  But...  what if the lines were to pulsate brightly in the direction of the spread every now and then?  May not be feasible, but I thought it would be interesting to watch my cyan culture lines pulsing towards complete domination.  >=D

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TheChronicToast
Join Date 03/2008
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Reply #19 April 16, 2012 11:29:35 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting CirdanNarya,
reply 18
lines were to pulsate brightly
A neat idea but I really would not want Sin's turned into a strobe-light.

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Volt_Cruelerz
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Reply #20 April 16, 2012 11:37:47 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

While that would be even easier to implement, graphically, I don't think it would look very good.

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Reply #21 April 24, 2012 6:13:33 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

.. bump?  I know it's not likely, but still..  It would be a wonderful addition, even if it doesn't make it into Sins I, there's always the potential that Sins II could exist...

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CirdanNarya
Join Date 08/2009
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Reply #22 April 24, 2012 9:01:38 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Why not make it into a culture check feature?  Then those who don't like pulsing lights don't have to see it until they want to know where culture is going.

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Freyja_Bjorn
Join Date 12/2011
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Reply #23 April 24, 2012 9:07:15 AM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Love to see this happen :]

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Reply #24 April 24, 2012 3:01:22 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Quoting CirdanNarya,
reply 22
Why not make it into a culture check feature?  Then those who don't like pulsing lights don't have to see it until they want to know where culture is going.

What do you mean?  When you mouse over a planet you see this?  I'd rather just get a glance look at it with arrows than pulsing or something like that.

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Teun-A-Roonius
Join Date 10/2009
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Reply #25 April 24, 2012 3:02:28 PM
from Sins of a Solar Empire ForumsSins of a Solar Empire Forums

Glowing Phase Lanes would be so sweet. Combined with Volts idea this could result into both a great interface and visual upgrade for the game.

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