now with structures having their own armor type, does anyone know, how much dmg capships make against them? because I thought it could be an interesting twist if capships were one of the few things half-way decent against starbases (other than structure busters, bombers of just plain numbers). after all, the banks were remodeled to fend off large amounts of weak enemies rather than few pretty strong enemies. could give ppl a bit more of an incentive to use them, if it was like in planet bombing. caps can do it, but not as efficiently as the specialised ship can (if you take cost into account), but they have better survivability.

From /gameinfo/gameplay.constants,

Capital ships and their abilities, Heavy Cruisers, and Anti-module (torpedo ships) all deal 100% damage to module (Starbases).*

Bombers and LRMs deal 75% damage. [But LRMs are rather squishy]

The remainder deal 50% damage.

Fundamentally, bring out the big guns to take down upgraded Starbases, not the popguns.

* And anti-module deals 1% damage to everything except module, incidentally, which is why the torpedo ships, despite their very high base damage, are practically useless against anything but structures despite their big and bright explosions.

Indeed, Shadowhal - it is a rather glaring weakness, for massed bombers hurt. I did state that this was versus the AI and primarily in sectors where I can build (at least) 25 points of tactical defense to get some fighter cover, even if only minimal. Against a human player, priorities might change, but those beefed up Vasari starbases are so damned tough that once I've slapped on the Assault Systems and full Defensive Enhancements (step 3->4 is truly beastly now), it seems to me to make much more sense to slap on additional survival systems rather than going for 8 fighter squadrons that'll be chewed up if the AI enemy is using a serious number of squads (or bringing flak frigates).

I haven't tried the TEC or Advent starbases yet, but the Vasari ones when set up for max survivability + Assault Systems made me a believer in the "oh, the AI brought a full fleet to my isolated starbase - it might need help in 5-10 minutes time, probably a handful of flak frigates and a few enforcers" principle.

-- That would never, ever, work against a human. Apart from the bomber issue, a particularly nasty human might decide to surround the starbase rather than having almost all the ships firing from in front. I haven't actually tested that it works that way, but the description of the Frontal Deflector Shields certainly suggests that it does.

Yep, and if playing e.g. Advent, in a system I would want to defend I'd be much more tempted to go for a Starbase with massed hangars with mass disorientation and meteor flinging behind a line of their (with expansion techs) very strong defensive structures maximizing the use of their combined arms approach. I haven't tried it, but at least on paper it looks like a great idea to use the Starbase more to control the situation while the static defenses (and any fleet in the vicinity) does the actual killing with an extra 14 squadrons helping - and it should be comparatively much easier to take out the enemy's torpedo ships (if any) before they significantly hurt the Starbase that way. Does this work in practice as well as in theory? Beats me - time will tell. It might be the worst idea since pre-sliced cucumber.

I was just about to make a thread about the same thing, wow!

Having 3 orgovs or starfish things with some flack cover park just out of reach of your 10000 credit starbase and blow it to bits with any fight is not my idea of fun . Still I don't think the anti stucture units are over powered just that they have too much range, if they would lower the range of the anti structure units it would force them to be in the direct line of fire, but don't forget this must also account for researchable range bonuses too so that with all bonuses starbases still have longer range. Flak turrets IMO aren't needed as badly,but still would be nice. A starbase with 4-8 fighters and 2-6 more in hangar def can easily fend off 30+ bombers, but 3 orgovs with good fighter cover and you're screwed ! The point of starbases is to be able to build/upgrade it and not need to phase your ships over to deal with the threat from that flank/planet.

Now on to the topic of starbase power: Starbases are not overpowered as is, the reason for the increase in power in beta 2.0 is the starbases weapon banks which can now multi task, not doing more damage persay, but killing 2-3 ships at once. If you rember the original starbases they were very vulnerable, they could be destroyed by a pirate raid or a light AI attack, the range and multi-bank increase is good and hopefully here to stay.

Well that's the galaxy as I see it!  Join us next time for ninja pizza! Why ninja pizza? I dunno, ask the gnomes.

No, they can't be shot down

would be a good idea f you were able to shoot them down

Hello again,

Thanks for the quick answer, Annatar11

It's a pity they can't be shot down; the anxiety of watching your doom encroach from out of range, and hoping that your flakk can save you would be fuckin' tense.

-Itharus